On July 1, the MTA is scheduled to take over the city’s seven private bus lines.
This week, city officials expressed concerns that the takeover will not be completed by the deadline, leaving the borough’s riders without any private bus service.
Officials said there’s a real possibility that the State Legislature will not be able to act on legislation required for the transfer to take place because the MTA hasn’t given enough information to the public or elected officials.
Council Transportation Committee Chairman John Liu called that scenario “an unacceptable disaster,” and blamed the MTA entirely. Assemblyman Barry Grodenchik said he will not act on any legislation until his questions are answered, and also blamed a lack of public information.
The bottom line is Queens needs buses to be running on these routes. Everyone involved in the transfer process, from the MTA to elected officials, must work together quickly to make sure no borough resident is left stranded.
The State Legislature cannot approach this issue as it does the budget – the July 1 deadline is not a suggestion, but solid, and it must be met. Concerns over lost routes and lost jobs must be addressed now to avoid any bus service stoppage. The MTA needs to provide the information, and the city should urge them to do so.
The Mayor – the man who made it a requirement for State legislation to pass before the transfer can take place – should also reconsider that requirement, and should make it his business to make sure things go smoothly on July 1. He wanted this transfer, now it’s time to make sure it happens correctly.
Getting these buses into MTA hands is the responsibility of everyone involved. If on July 1, Queens residents standing at bus stops are stranded, there should be no finger pointing – it’s everyone’s fault.
The real bottom line for the take over could be anywhere from 500 million to 1 billion dollars!!!!!! Somebody SHOULD be asking the questions that the MTA and Bloomberg don't want to give answers to!!
1. MTA - New York City Transit
2. New Jersey Transit
3. MTA - Los Angeles
4. Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority (WMATA)
5. MTA Baltimore
6. SEPTA (I can't believe I just said that. If you know me, I was NEVER a SEPTA fan until recently)
7. Ride-On
8. Toronto Transit Commission
9. AC Transit
10. San Francisco MUNI
These are my top ten TA's
How about you guys?
Ray
In fact, I don't think I even know ten TA's...I'll have to think about this...
Ray
Ray
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
-Fred
1) Montgomery County Transit (Ride-On)
2) San Francisco MUNI
3) Sacramento RTD
4) AC Transit (Oakland)
5) WMATA (Metro)
6) PACE (Suburban Chicago)
7) Chicago Transit Authority
8) Dallas Area Rapid Transit
9) CAT Las Vegas
10) Blacksburg Transit
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
1. Ride On (of course)
2. WMATA
3. Frederick Transit (MD)
4. SEPTA
5. DASH (VA)
6. CUE (VA)
7. MTA (Baltimore)
8. DART (Delaware)
9. Miami Valley RTA (Dayton, Ohio)
10. New Jersey Transit
and yes I've ridden all these properties
1) PRTC
2) Ride On
3) CUE
4) WMATA
5) NYCT
6) Frederick, MD
7) Orlando LYNX
8) SEPTA
9) MBTA-Boston
10) DASH
-F.
-Fred
-Valley Metro (Roanoke, VA)
-HRT (Hampton Roads, VA)
-Blacksburg Transit (VA)
-WMATA (DC, of course)
-Ride-On (Montgomery Co., MD)
-DDOT (Detroit, MI)
-MTA (Baltimore, MD)*
-The Rapid (Grand Rapids, MI)
-RTA (Cleveland, OH)
-TARTA (Toledo, OH)
There is an asterisk by the MTA as I have not yet visited their garage or rode their system. But I LOVE the fact that they still run Flxibles every day, despite their abusive treatment I hear about.
-F.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
As for the MTA, thats a whole another story.
Trevor
-F.
And of course, I'm with you on WMATA...another backyard favorite!
-Fred
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
-Fred
1)RIDE ON
2)DelDOT
3)DASH
4)CUE
5)Frederick Transit
6)GRTC(now if they had something other than Gilligs, euch)
7)WMATA(I live in PG this is part of the reason, why they are so low)
8)SEPTA
9)PRTC
10)Fairfax Connector(Soon to be the Orion Transit Company)
As you can tell THE BUS isn't on there neither is Baltimore MTA, don't wonder why.
Also - I forgot to include NYBS, LLE and SEPTA as favorites of mine. I'm sure I'd have PRTC too but I've never ridden any of their buses. I'm sure that'll change soon:-).
B. Very complete and through coverage area. They have many densely populated residential and commercial areas (Kensington, Bethesda, Silver Spring, Wheaton, Gaithersburg, Germantown, Rockville, Langley Park, Takoma Park) covered quite well in terms of number of routes and frequency of service. Hell, if I really wanted to, I could walk to the 10, but its quite a long walk to Tech Road for me. I don't exactly see a healthy and wide range of service frequency and availability in PG County:-)
C. Fare media. You cannot go wrong with the 20 Trip Ticket. It is easy to find at your local library, liquor store, or Giant Food, and is easy to use; just hand it to the driver so he can punch a hole in it. I would respect the other TA's alot more if they used a type of media like the 20 Trip Ticket. It makes life so much easier for the rider not having to fumble for change.
D. Variety. Although it goes against the goal of standardization, which makes maintaining a bus fleet much easier in the long run, Ride-On has a very diverse fleet of bus types, ranging from Orion Is, Vs, VIs, and VIIs, Gilligs, and even Flxibles, which adds excitement to each ride. You never know what will show up on any given route, with a few limitations due to garage assignments (i.e., Orion VIs in the 15, or '95 Gillig on the 55).
E. Personnel. As far as I am concerned, the drivers, though not always happy-go-lucky, are for the most part, consistent and dependable. How often do you hear me, Ray, or Garnier bitch about Ride-On drivers?
Chuck Greene
Mass transit makes you mind your schedule to suit the bus/trolley schedule. It's not that hard to do, most of the time.
Chuck Greene
Then, this afternoon on the 37, all the buses were Orion Is: 5514 (the one I rode), 5542, and 5545.
On Memorial Day I rode PATCO & The RiverLINE and had substantial waits. I wasn't upset because it was a Holiday schedule and I was just riding around anyway. "No particular place to go" (Old Chuck Berry song).
Chuck Greene
-Fred
-F.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
-F.
It is too bad Ride-On doesn't have a rail component...
1.) Excellent service for a suburban environment, a MAXIMUM of 30 minute headway no matter which route, which day, or what time of day. My home route serves me every 15 minutes during weekday off-peak, every 10-12 minutes peak hours, every 20 minutes on saturdays, every 30 minutes on sundays. All until 11, 12, or 1 AM.
2.) Ideal coverage and route formats. Routes aren't like Jigsaw puzzles like NOVA routes, taking 45 minutes to travel a total of 2 miles. Nor are they like Baltimore MTA's marathon routes, supersized routes taking 2 hours or more to complete. Ride On's routing is great, not too long, not too short, excellent routing selection, serving only what is neccesary while not destroying ride time, etc, etc.
3.) The fleet, the backbone of the system.6 manufacterers, 9 models of buses, 20 different configuration of buses. Everything from El Dorado/International Cutaways to 30' Orion Is to 40' Orion VI CNGs to 40' Flxible Metro-Ds. Ride On has an EXCELLENT fleet diversity, so many configurations of buses, none of them are boring. Ride On also does an excellent job speccing their buses, perfect seat selection, perfect features, their buses are designed for their job. Not to mention the most exciting powertrain combinations, no Allison Worlds here (except the 1999 Gilligs), everything is either a Voith, ZF, or the good ole fashioned Allison HT series. Ride On knows what a PAINT JOB is all about, and they keep their buses in top notch condition, yet not over-excessively perfect.
4.) Service, Ride On knows what it's all about. Most drivers are nice and courteous, often ignoring the book in order to please the passenger. You never hear a story about a Ride On driver slapping a pregnant girl for vomiting on the bus (*cough*Baltimore MTA*cough*) The one and only time I went to headquarters to complaint about a situation, the customer service agent gave me direct and immediate attention, she contacted central while I still standing there in order for central to radio the driver of her wrong-doing. In addition, the customer service agent sent me 2 free-ride vouchers the following day.
5.) The cost, I can tell you all that I have rode well over 1,000 miles on Ride On this year alone. And I have probably only paid a total of $10 for all the 1,000+ miles. Why?
a.) My student ID is accepted as valid fare on Mondays-Fridays 2-7 PM.
b.) The infamous 20 Trip ticket, $13 ticket with 20 valid trips, each with a 2+ hour transfer (although most drivers issue transfers exceeding 4 hours).
Not only that, Montgomery County (operator of Ride On) has even paid WMATA to accept student IDs as valid fare media so we students in Montgomery county can ride both Ride On and WMATA both alike all over Montgomery County as we please.
As 1C/Ballston has mentioned, Ride On is the role model of a perfect Transit System, yet it is not perfect.
Saw them on the news the other night; apparently a car ran into one of their new Opus coaches. The car was torn to bits, but the bus suffered virtually no damage. Ugly, but strong!
They run mostly Gilligs, but have a few Thomas SLFs in regular service. Back in the day, they were a FLXIBLE town! In fact, a couple of their New Looks made it all the way to Rutgers. :)
-Fred
I agree with you on the all-Gillig thing; they were a Flxible town until the past few years. When I went there twice a week on business in 1996, they still ran Flx new Looks in the old Orange and Tan colors, and there were Metros as far as the eye can see. Then one week, Gilligs started rolling in, and the New Looks went bye-bye. :(
We recently got ex-GRTC Flxible Metro no. 309 at our local museum; I was glad to see it come in, but I really hoped to catch one while it was still in Richmond daily service. Oh well..we've got one now, and that's all that matters. You can see it at www.commonwealthcoach.com.
-Fred
To give you an idea of what the inside of the Flx looks like, it looks MUCH older than 1990. The seats are a mix of white, red, and yellow; it looks more like something out of the Seventies. Every time I step into that thing, it's like I'm on the set of "Three's Company". Hope Mr. Roper doesn't find out the truth about me...LOL!
-Fred
-Fred
1 WMATA
2 Montgomery County (MD) Ride-On
3 MARTA
4 NYCTA
5 LAMTA
6 Fairfax Connector
7 New Jersey Transit
8 Baltimore MTA
9 CT (Connecticut)
10 Metro-Dade
1]NY- MTA - Biggest and the best
2]WMATA - Just for Metrorail. They have to treat Metrobus much better
3]SEPTA - Like the equipment, Hate the assholes running and managing it.
4]NJT - They should realize that there is life below Trenton.
5]DART - Wilmington's little bus system that could.
Those are the ones I'm familiar with and ride with any frequency. The ones I would like to ride are:
6]CTA - I hope to ride in the Windy City this summer
7]MBTA - I want to get there before the Secret Service screws everything up
8]SF Muni - I have to get to Cali just once and that is what I want to ride
9]BART - see Muni
10]LACMTA - After seeing Salaam Allah's pics, I want to ride to my heart's content.
1:Miami Dade Transit
2:Westchester Bee Line System
3:LYNX(Orlando,Fl)
4:MTA LIBus
5:Suffolk County Transit
6:Los Angeles MTA
7:Orange County TA(Anaheim,CA)
8:WMATA
9:NJTransit
10:MTA-NYCT
Da Hui
1. Lowell (MA) Regional Transit Authority. Have to put my hometown TA as first choice. They are making service improvements and they have 1992 Flxible Metro C's, riding them while they're still here, over the next 3 years Gillig Advantages are coming to replace them.
2. MBTA. They have improved over the past few years, and they have a bit more variety in the fleet including artics.
3. CY Ride, Ames Iowa. They are one of the last TA's in the country to still operate Fishbowls, including a 1964 ex- Long Beach CA bowl that's still in great shape!! They also have fleet variety including Orion 1's and V's, Gillig Phantoms and Advantages too.
4. Portland ME Metro. For a city of it's size, they have great schedules and service. They have 8 routes, most on 30 to 60 min. headways weekdays (Route 4 has 15 min headways weekday AM & PM rush, Route 2 has 20 min headways all day weekdays) 4 of which operate past 8 PM Mon-Sat, 2 routes operate on Sundays. They also have 1990 Flxible Metro B's that will be around for another year or 2.
5. Chittenden County Transit Authority Burlington VT. Another well run transit system in a small Northern New England city, most routes operating on 30 to 60 min. headways during the day, some routes even running till 11PM weekdays, about 7:15 on Saturdays, limited Sunday service. Fleet is mostly Nova RTS, 30, 35 & 40 footers. Also a couple of Optima Low Floors.
6. RIPTA. Another well run system with a beautiful transfer station (Kennedy Plaza in Downtown Providence) plus some fleet variety. TMC & Nova RTS, and Orion V's along with Chance Heritage Trolleys.
7. Snata Monica (CA) Big Blue Bus. Nice system, good headways, and the owners of the last Fishbowl ever built!!
8. Cape Ann Transit Authority Gloucester MA. They get the nod for the most scenic routes on a TA that I've been on. The Red Line & Blue Line routes from Gloucester to Rockport are a must ride. The Red Line actually hugs the Atlantic Ocean at a couple of points in the Bass Rocks area of Gloucester. They also have (5) 1995 Flxible Metro E's 30 & 35 footers, plus some 30 & 35 foot Nova RTS, plus they usually have a few older buses bought from other RTA's for spares/trippers. haven't been up there in a while to see what they have in the spare fleet.
9. Brockton (MA) Area Transit. Good system, convenient pulse point. All TMC and Nova RTS fleet 30 & 35 footers, plus 3 DuPOn Champlain trolley buses.
10. Merrimack Valley (Haverhill MA) RTA. Good system, they are the only TA in MA to own MCI commuter coaches (5 D-4000's, 4 they run and 1 leased to a private operator) for Boston line runs. They also run seasonal service to Salisbury Beach & Hampton NH Beach. Unfortunetly, no fleet variety. 44 Gillig Phantom 35 footers (14 from 1996, 12 from 1999, and 18 2004's).
It was tough to come up with a top 10, but those are my choices.
Mark
On my end, I guess you could say it was to my....Advantage. :)
-F.
1)THE BUS(I could go on and on but I would scare people away)
2)Annapolis Transit(alot of their routes are overcrowded, buses in bad shape, even the newer ones, timed transfers are good, if all buses are running on time-as I found out the last time I went there)
3)Baltimore MTA(thank god the bus drivers, and other working stiffs are saving this, the management and the attention paid to it is horrible, plus they have Flxes and I like their Neos-the ones not blowing out black smoke to beat the band)
4)Loudoun Transit(They have some hope in that Loudoun County isn't that big yet, and the buses they use are suitable for their service.)
5)Corridor Transit(Truck buses, truck buses, and more truck buses. If they could only bring back those ex Hagerstown Orion Is. It is not good when your best buses are Goshen CADVs)
6)Howard Transit(Truck, buses, and more truck buses. Their saving grace is have some new SLFs-we think, Blue Birds-not all that great, and Flxibles-though I don't think they are running anymore :( )
7)ART(They don't even have a real bus garage, just a lot, in Fairfax County and not in Arlington. Like Loudoun they have somewhat of a future in that they could buy real buses, though I would doubt that happening soon)
These are all of the T/As I have ridden so far I hope to ride a lot more this year.
1)NYCTA(might get my chance in late June)
2)NJ Transit
3)PAT(Pittsburgh)
4)CTA
5)LAMCTA
6)MARTA
7)Miami Dade
8)Houston
9)MBTA
10)Seattle(mainly for the hybrid artics)
11)I know I said ten but I had to throw in MUNI
-NYCTA (Where else?)
-TTC (Toronto)
-CTA (Chicago)
-MTA (Baltimore)
-LRTA (Lowell, MA)
-VTA (Santa Clara, CA)
-SMMBL (Santa Monica, CA)
-NJT (All over New Jersey)
-Academy (Jersey again)
-NYBS (before they get taken over and dump their Fishbowls).
-F.
Muni (San Francisco, CA)
AC Transit(Oakland, CA)
VTA (San Jose, CA)
Samtrans(San Metao County, CA)
Golden Gate Transit(San Rafael, CA)
Santa Cruz Metro(Santa Cruz, CA)
Union City Transit
Tridelta(Pittsburg, CA)
Citizen Area Transit (Las Vegas, NV)
Citifare(Reno, NV)
And if I could get on a time machine back to around 1980, I would go for the following:
Muni (San Francisco, CA)
AC Transit(Oakland, CA)
Citizen Area Transit (Las Vegas, NV)
-F.
If you went back around 1980....
AC Transit's GM/Flxible New looks dominated the fleet with
brand new Flyer D901's, and MAN SG220's artics.
Muni's trolley buses were Flyer E800's and diesel buses were GM/Flxible New looks, AMG's and Grumman 870's.
I don't know anything about Las Vegas back then because I was a
tiny baby when my mother took me with her.but I assume there were
GM/Flxible New looks as well.
IIRC, the Las Vegas Grummans date back to around 1979.
-F.
As for CAT, it's one of today's fastest-growing transit systems. They have close to 400 buses now and some pretty tight service. Mind you, NONE of the credit for this expansion is due to ATC/Vancom. Yes -- the system is 100% privately operated, but the push to expand and all of the funding to make it happen came from the public RTC, which is the overseer of CAT. Hopefully ATC/Vancom will bury its ugly head in Las Vegas soon. A lot of people in Vegas think that private operation has run its course and it's time to operate it publically. I for one think that would be a huge stride in the right direction.
1-CAT-citizens Area Transit-Las Vegas.
2-PACE-Chicago Suburbs.
3-MTA-LIBUS-love the Gilligs.
4-Suffolk Transit-for the Flexible Metros.
5-CTA-Chicago Transit Authority.
6-MTA-NYCBUS.
7-MTA-orignally Mobile Transit Authority-the ad wraps those buses had were fantastic.
8-SEPTA-nice.
9-Green-love the MCI Classics.
10-GBTA-Greater Bridgeport Transit Authority-went there once-all buses coverge at the transit center.
1.) Ride On, Ride On, Ride On (need I say more? ;-))
2.) Queens Surface Corp.
3.) Shuttle-UM
4.) DASH
5.) SEPTA
6.) WMATA
7.) Baltimore MTA
8.) NYC MTA
9.) Fairfax Connector
10.) PG's The Bus
But in terms of service levels, it does take all levels to have frequent bus service. Montgomery County is dedicated to having the best bus service that it can offer to its customers. Though they have eliminated some routes(for good reason), I have not heard once of RIDE ON cutting back service because of budget shortfalls. Other governments have done so, losing more passengers and having to cut service some more. If more governments were more dedicated to having the best transit service for its customers, then frequent service wouldn't be a problem. Saying the money isn't there isn't an excuse, there is always a way to fund better transit, it is just some governments don't feel the same about transit that others do. Most governments think of transit as "Oh we need to give the people who can't afford a car something to get here and there" instead of "We need to provide the best service to our constiutents as possible and we need to use every resource or every avenue to make sure that service is possible".
To take on an old addage(sp?)If you build it they will come, but if you make it the best they will come in droves.
1. SEPTA (Flyer Central)
2. NYCTA (RTS Heaven Number 1)
3. WMATA (Even better service)
4. RIDE-ON (Good service)
5. LACMTA: Has all my favorites (RTS, NABI, NFI)
6. PITTSBURGH (Interesting Color Fleet)
7. DETROIT (RTS Heaven besides NYC)
8. CHICAGO (Has everything under the sun
9. San Francisco (ETBs & PCCs, can't beat it)
10.MTA Maryland (the last system i would want to ride but i live there)
1. NYCMTA
2. WMAta
3. ride on
4. pat
5. lamta
6. CAT (harrisburg)
7. MArTA
8. RIPTA
9. SEPTA
10. NYDOT
1) NYCTA: C'mon, the subway system, even if the buses suck, you can't get a subway system like that anywhere else.
2) SEPTA: We have terrific infrastructure, a now relatively modern and fully compatible fleet, and hopefully at some point in the future our current administration will be retired.
3) KC Metro: I grew up on this system, so I admit to viewing it through rose colored glasses, but it's similar to SEPTA in that it has excellent infrastructure, but somewhat lackluster management.
4) SF Muni: Of all systems in the US I think Muni may be among the most far thinking and progressive systems in a large city (that being NY, LA, Chicago, SF, Philly, Houston, and the like). They have a ETB network that saves the city millions a year, even beating the Muni Metro LRV from a cost per passenger perspective.
5) Chicago CTA: I managed to live there for 3 years and never rode any of their system really. But they have buses in excellent condition, a fairly tight knit transit system providing good service to their area, and a downtown El. Finally they seem to have some very realistic plans for the future.
6) MBTA: Another system blessed with a fairly good infrastructure and a debatable management and political leadership. Nonetheless, the Green line, Harvard busway ETB system and the subway system are great. I'm hoping that they drop the silver lie foolishness and eventually electrify their diesel commuter lines.
The following I have not ridden, or rode a long long time ago, so I don't remember it, but their reputation precedes them.
7) Portland Tri-met: Probably the best application of european city planning in the US at this point. A small city served by an excellent LRV system with collector bus lines. Many TAs would do well to watch their progress and copy their operations, if not their equipment. I understand the SD660s on the MAX line have been slightly under expectations.
8) Dayton MVRTA: A system similar in scale to Ride On, but which benefits from both a truely centralized ridership base, as well as a historical ETB system. This shows how the "we're too small" argument against widespread electrification of a system is complete bullshit. They run an effective system, and despite previous snubbing by the UMTA back in the 70s, gyping them of their well deserved LRV system, they have carried on.
9) TTC: Just a system I really want to see. Arguably the last true trolley system in North America, and their subways look cool too. It's just too bad they killed off the ETB system, perhaps someday they can get it back.
10) New Orleans RTA, they have some very cool things. I'm really interested to see their old 1920s era trolleys and such. Also it'd be cool to see the new trolleys built with BMEC B-3 trucks, just like the SEPTA PCC IIs.
-Blacksburg Transit, circa 2000
-Valley Metro (Roanoke), circa 1982
-GLTC (Lynchburg), circa same era
-GRTC (Richmond), circa 1996
-WMATA (DC), circa 1999
-Baltimore MTA, circa 1995 (smell the new Flxes)
-Nashville MTA, circa 2001 (safely puts me in Flx zone)
-Chicago CTA, early 1990s
-Cleveland RTA, circa 2000 (before the LFS/NABI invasion)
-SORTA (Cincinnati), circa 1994. MAD Flxes rolled around back then, and did stupid Fred park the car and RIDE one?!? NOOOOOOOOOoooooo!!!!
-F.
I like thier system!
-Fred
"It's SORTA transit".
If I could travel back to the past...
SEPTA circa 2002- DKs, DKs, everywhere, although I would've loved to still be able to ride the 8000's and 35ft BPs. However, I would miss the ZFers and the 5600s. My big neos would still be fresh, as would my El Dorados. Of course, I would miss the Champions!
Ride-On circa 1993 - I miss my TMC citycruisers, and today Ride-On is Orion V/VII dominated - not that it's a bad thing, though. No 35ft Gilligs dominated the system, though.
Not to mention that the 35ft Gilligs, Orion Is, and exactly 2 Orion Vs DOMINATED the system. No running all over the place to say goodbye or enjoy a ride on these!
WMATA circa 1995 - I know, the WMATA Neos weren't around yet! However, I love the convenient access to Flxes (and the Es were brand new in their scheme - hot!), and the Orion Vs (1992) still had their 6V92TAs, sounding as Neo as ever. Plus, I'd love to ride a MAN bus again. The RTSs...eh. Oh, and if I really wanted to, I could a New Look.
In other words, I'd go back to my younger childhood.
-F.
-Fred
The 2 things I'm trying to find are:
1) I remember that the color scheme at that time was orange and green, but would love to find pictures to support that. Is there a good site that might have such pictures? Tried a few links from here, but no luck. Side question: I mostly remember the old "Fishbowl" busses, but there were a few old ones still running around at that time, mostly on the #5 Nepperhan Ave. route....does anyone know what type those were (I'm assuming GM)?
2) The Nodine Hill bus. Just like watching "One of these is not like the other" from Sesame Street...these busses (at that time) appeared to be a smaller GM type bus, but sounded MUCH heavier for their size, and did not have the green/orange scheme but rather the busses were gray with a white roof. I always thought it was strange that these stuck out like a sore thumb. Was this an independent company at that time??
Forgive me if these are silly questions...but I was about 8 years old at the time! Shortly after this time, they became simply silver and blue...eventually the Nodine Hill bus was also replaced with the Fishbowl. Haven't live in Yonkers for over 20 years, and I recently saw a Corgi model of the red Liberty Lines Fishbowl...and that brought back all these memories!!
Any info would be greatly appreciated!
I don't have much knowledge of Yonkers buses, but the main operator had been Yonkers Transit, which didn't own any old-look GMC buses, just Macks. However, at some point, someone (Club Transportation?) took over Yonkers Transit routes, so there may have been GMC old-looks on the former Yonkers Transit routes after the takeover. Yonkers Transit had mostly older Macks, but did get a few newer ones similar to those that ran in Buffalo, NY, and with Bee Line in Rockville Centre.
Good to hear from someone from the old hometown, where few of my relatives still live. By the way, there is a street named after me in Yonkers. In 1961, my grandfather, Dominick DeMatteo, was working the buildings department when a developer came in with a plat and asked if anyone had a name for the street. Since I was his first grandchild, he suggested Larry Place. I understand it's somewhere off Palmer Road, and contains houses built in my birth year, 1961.
I married a girl born in Brooklyn, so here I am. But at least I'm up on the terminal morraine, the only hill on Long Island. When you are going west on the BQE, just over the hump past the Brooklyn Battery Tunnel, our part of Brooklyn looks like Yonkers.
I'm surprised with all the rail and bus fans out there...can't seem to find any pictures!
I grew up at 137 Van Cortlandt Park Avenue, in a two family my grandfather built. My mother grew up further down toward Elm, in an apartment building at (I think) Thurman across from PS 23 where I went to school. My grandmother grew up on New Main Street, 10 kids in a little apartment. They basically just moved up the hill.
Do you recall a massive fire across from the school in, say, 1970 or 1971. Shades of what was to come for the 'hood I'm afraid. My grandmother moved out of a senior citizen's home on Willow Street just before the whole area burned.
...forgot to mention...you're the only other person I know who actually called it a "hot pie"! I haven't heard that term in YEARS! I don't know if that was a Yonkers term...but I'll tell ya, I think Yonkers is the only area that calls it a "wedge"! Living outside of Philadelphia now for the past 20 years...it's a "hoagie". But, man, the first time I moved down here and I asked for a "salami wedge", the deli guy thought I was crazy and I actually wanted a hunk of salami cut into a wedge shape!
My Dad paid his way through college, in part, by shovelling coal into the boilers in "The Sugar House." My uncle worked for Phelps Dodge.
(...forgot to mention...you're the only other person I know who actually called it a "hot pie"! I haven't heard that term in YEARS!)
That's what my grandmother called it. Maybe it's a Yonkers Italian thing.
That is really interesting!
I had a friend from high school and college who lived at 10 Larry Place. We fell out of touch, but I think his family still lives there.
I also dated a girl who lived on Victoria Lane located behind Larry Place. Both streets are cul-de-sacs.
That area is one of the best areas left in Yonkers. It is still very suburban. In the area there is a bridge that only allows traffic flow in one direction only at one time. Cars on the other end must wait to cross. The area was predominantly Italian the last time I was there - like in the late 90s.
Now the rest of what I have to say may belong more on Subtalk
but......
Larry Place is located off of Miles Square Road. Before you cross Palmer, up until 10 years ago, there was an old wooden railroad crossing that marked the site of the crossing of "The Old Put" Putnam line of the NY Central. It has been eliminated and a small playground is now there. At the intersection of Palmer, off to the side, the owner of a fruit market has rebuilt the station house that used to be at that site marking the Brynmawr station. His market is inside the house. Word has it that he was able to get his hands on the original blueprints of the station house to rebuild it to the exact original measurements.
Anywhere near Cook Field? My grandfather's club used to have big summer barbeques there, and later my mother's cousins threw "Prota Picnics" there for several years. As a kid, I remember walking over to the tracks to work off some of the hot dogs and birch beer.
Back on topic. My wedding was on Long Island (wife's territory), and my Mom rented a BUS to bring all the relatives down from Westchester. They didn't know from Long Island. The all moved "up the line."
Cook field is now called Redmond Field...has been for quite some time now! I still call it Cook Field though. My dad belonged to the Slovak club, which used to be on Walnut, but now on Lockwood...anyway, they had their summer picnics at Cook field too. Used to watch the 3-4 car freight trains run behind.
Larry Place?...off Mile Square....would that be between Palmer and where Mile Square and Cook Ave. split?...just near the playground mentioned?
Big fire around 1970...yes, I do remember that! Kid from my grade school (I went to St. Casimirs) lived in one of the houses....damned if I can remember his name though!...thought it was "Daniel", but not sure. I seemed to remember that just about anybody in the area pitched in and helped the firefighters.
Alas...still can't get any info on the old Yonkers busses :-(
But, still cool to talk to someone who knows the "old neighborhood"!
Went to CCD at St. Casmirs. My mother and my friends mother would alternate picking us up and walking us home afterward. But once Frankie wasn't going and her mother forgot to come get me. After a while, I was stranded on the wrong side of Nepperhan with no way of knowing how to get home. Then I spotted the nastiest thug in school heading up the hill, past the triangular factory building on the other side of Nepperhan. Keeping a safe distance, I followed him and his gang until I got up toward Oak/Willow and recongized where I was. Found "the city stairs" that took you up past "Jerrys" barber shop and walked home.
Do you remember the hobby store in the big apartment building (now abandoned I think) at the corner of Elm and VanCortlant? And did you ever go to "Jacks" at Spruce and Van Cortlandt?
Ah, wasting Dave's bandwidth. Back on topic (sort of). Never saw anything on Yonkers buses, but I did see a (I think) Third Avenue Railroad map somewhere (the Transit Museum) that did show the old trolley routes running up in southern Westchester, the predecessor of today's bus routes. It was interesting to see, but before my time.
http://www.njtransit.com/ta_adjustment_project.jsp?ID=1981 says that the last weekend in June, Academy/22 Hillside LLC's two non-NJT routes, the 22 Hillside and the Blvd East local, will become NJT-contract routes (numbered 22 and 23 respectively) run initially with a mix of Academy and NJT units. One place the contract route will not serve is Mediterranean Towers on the 22.
http://www.njtransit.com/ta_adjustment_project.jsp?ID=1941 says that the same weekend, the 123 (Union City) and 125 (Journal Square) routes that are currently NJT-contract, will be taken over by NJT (Meadowlands will house the buses there). With these changes will come noticeable adjustments in how passengers will be handled at the Troy Towers and Lenox highrises on the 123.
Timetables will be available mid-June.
BOB
In the past year, Academy had cut back the frequency of buses on both of these routes. The notice suggests that the weekday frequency on the 22 will be cut further, while weekend frequency remains the same.
The service was exceptional, it ran like a waterfall (just about every 5-10 minutes). When I moved back into the Bronx in 2003, right before I moved out of NJ, The 22 Hillside Service had improved yet deminished. The Buses used were in better shape: Nova RTSs, Flxible METRO Bs and some ex-MTA RTSs. BUT the service level had shrunk.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Several of which have passed through Nimco in the past month.
Irony here is, the 22 was a TNJ route into the 70s. TNJ dumped it in favor of 22-Hillside IBOA just as they dropped the 31 for South Orange Ave IBOA. Academy bought out Hillside IBOA. Now, NJT "takes back" the 22.
That's just my opinion. What do you think?
MetroB
I agree that the Jersey City area IBOAs could be next, but keep in mind - just like the 22-Hillside, these were old PS/TNJ routes that were abandoned because the IBOAs undercut their fares. Now the IBOAs are having trouble surviving.
Jason
MetroB
810/New Brunswick to Woodbridge Center via NJ 27: Ironbound
811/New Brunswick to South River: Hamilton (if it were extended further south to, say, the Princeton/Plainsboro Twp area via the US 1 corridor)
813/Perth Amboy to Middlesex County College: Ironbound
814/New Brunswick to Edison: Hamilton
815/New Brunswick to Woodbridge Center via Old Bridge: Ironbound
817/Perth Amboy to Campbell's Junction: Ironbound
818/New Brunswick to Old Bridge via NJ 18: Howell
819/Piscataway to Middlesex Mall: probably Ironbound
822/Plainfield: Ironbound
Some of the routes that originate near Woodbridge Center could also be assigned to Hilton, since Maplewood Twp isn't too far from the GSP, and buses could deadhead down the Parkway to Woodbridge (they could, right?). I would suspect that Maplewood is actually closer to Woodbridge than Newark from a driving mileage standpoint.
Again, this is all hypothetical, and assumes that NJT actually wants to directly operate the Middlesex routes, which I doubt that they do.
Would new bus service in that area would survive?
MetroB
Ray
HOWEVER!!!!
The buses leaves NY so packed and its usually 3-4 buses leaving on the same schedule, that NJT places a bus at Newark just for the Newark passengers.
Coming back its almost 5-6 buses that come back, why does more people come back then going, I dont know.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Ray
I'll take tons of photos and share the news with you ...
Any news over past weekend?
Were the designers of the first RTS dreaming up a beauty mobile, or a bus? The RTS is poor in both possible scenarios
I guess the drivers compartment was only a NYC thing. NO driver, NOT A ONE, has ever complained about the drivers compartment down here.
I've been on some pretty old, cold RTS buses before. The ones that had the problem with HVAC were the older RTS 01 and 03 models.
How do you know the defrosters on every bus operate like that? Could be just that one bus.
I've seen RTS buses with huge mirrors. It depends if the TA feels like retrofitting them. Besides, have you seen the mirrors on the Neoplan AN440? Guess not.
How are the doors too narrow? Because a wheelchair can't get through the front? Boo hoo. The RTS boards passengers faster than the NFI Artics that have replaced them on the Manhattan routes.
I'm guessing the designers were trying to do both, and they succeeded. Now, please boy, go back to complaining about Gun Hill Artics ad nauseum, it's what you do best, if not the only thing you can do at all.
Toodles.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
And I'm only 5'11"
Old buses suck. NFI is the best thing that the bus industry has right now
Da Hui
Cleanairbus
This is a subway (IRT Lex Line). This is a stupid excuse for a subway (IND Second Avenue Line). Any questions?
Da Hui
When it come to subways though, Ridgewood has everything I can ask for. Brand new R160's coming soon on the (M) line, R143 on the (L), plus the (L) is a short trip to Manhattan where I can ride just about every other line in the city, lucky me.
When it come to buses though, it's horrible. No variety what-so-ever. The only place that still uses old hand-down from other depots that are in crap condition. And FP leaves them the same way.
I hope Maspeth Depot comes out so it can kill this crappy ass RTS dominance in FP.
Da Hui
Be happy that I'm not head of the DOB otherwise FP would be nothing but pre 90 RTS' and Remans.All the ones still left and those in storage,to FP they would go.You wanna trash old buses,trash the 8000's that've been repowered,NOW THOSE ARE THE ONE'S THAT SUCK ASS!!
Da Hui
I just hope Maspeth depot will come out, that way i can abandon FP and it's crappiness. I hope those buses will be gone for good, I won't miss them, and neither will the Brooklyn bustalkers here.
For bustalkers, don't ever move to where i'm at, you would easily be dissappointed.
Da Hui
What is with this mirror business? Are mirrors supposed to be like those Setra buses (the overhangs). BIG MORRORS ARE NICE AND ALL BUT THEY MAY NOT BE THE BEST FOR NARROW SPACES _ I DUNNO SORRY FOR THE CAPS SOMETHING HAPPENED TO THE COMPUTER AND THE SHIFT KEY OR SOMETHING IS STUCK BUT I WANTED TO MAKE MY POINT
Tony M.
NJT Bus Operator!
Also, the number 2605 bears a great significance to me, albeit on another type of bus; that was a Flxible Metro, the very first bus that I rode at nearby Blacksburg Transit. BT still has them around as trippers and football shuttles; they were mothballed in favor of ADA-compliant New Flyers. :( It would have been cheaper to rehab the Flxes and put in lifts, but the ball is not in my court on that one.
-F.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
A wide door? NABI, that's what! Also, NABI is the only bus that has form fitting slide-glide, makes it look nice!
The Orion V is good too, only for some reason (is this a newer Orion V thing?) half the door is hanging out of the bus.
Plug type doors don't really go that far out, you know. You'd be surprised. Also, if the bus was too close for plug doors to work, then it's really too close to work, I guess.
Given that I've never seen two passengers pass simultaneously through the front door of any other bus, the width on the RTS doesn't appear to be a bottleneck. (For boarding passengers, the farebox is the width in any case.)
The HVAC works quite well as long as it's maintained properly. I've never seen problems with the defrosters; could it be that you happened to be riding a bus which had a broken defrosting system?
Seeing as I've never driven a bus, RTS or otherwise, I can't comment on the driver compartment or mirror placement.
And even if these were legitimate design flaws, isn't 'horrible' a slight exaggeration? Oh, wait, I forgot who this was coming from. To you, if it's more than five years old, it's horrible.
In fact, it is probably a kind of tribute to the unique design, proven strength, and unusually long life (or is it nine lives?) of this vehicle, that we are still here discussing it, pro and con.
I look forward to the low floor discussions and comparisons between manufacturers' products when the new low-floor RTS model makes her debut.
THE DRIVER'S AREA
I'm not that big a person, but i'm all cramped up in a RTS's driver's compartment. Now the RTS Wide Front Door version I can party with.
Trevor
Nice to see the 15 return to it's home route.
~In PA, it's the 95. In MD, it's the 15.
Long live Montgomery County Transit
The following buses can keep their current numbers:
GREEN: 701-716, 719-722, 1143-1182
COMMAND: 357-380
QUEENS: 318-319
TRIBORO: 681-794, 1183-1184, 3000-3071
JAMAICA: 3701, 3830-3865 (Event though this is an active MTA series, all buses with these numbers are off the property; at Nimco)
NYBS: 1600-1716, 1800-1805 (whole fleet; Fishbowls not included)
Renumbering:
Amazingly, every bus can keep its last three digits. For those with 3 digits, all you have to do is slap a "thousands" digit on. For the others, you just have to change the thousands digit.
GREEN:
222-292——1222-1292
602-654——2602-2654,
5501-5550—— 3501-3550
COMMAND:
421-499—— 2421-2499
4903-4978—— 5903-5978
QUEENS:
294-317—— 1294-1317
401-499—— 1401-1499
517-535—— 1517-1533
568-581—— 1568-1581
901-954—— 9901-9954
TRIBORO:
640-680—— 3640-3680
2050-2073—— 7050-7033
2136-2147—— 7136-7147
2801-2829—— 9801-9829
JAMAICA:
501-530—— 2501-2530
551-585—— 2551-2585 or 3551-3585
601-608 —— 3601-3608
LIBERTY:
3001-3077—— 0001-0077
Any corrections (oversignts, etc) welcome.
But I have also compiled a total roster, with some alternatives. for one thing, I did not include the new buses that are to be ordered.
At first, it was said to be about 400. That would fit neatly in 3100-3499. 1984 MTA holdout 3469 would be retired or renumbered.
But then I started hearing 600. If these will be different makes or models (hope they are getting some artics, as was said before), then it could be fragmented. Otherwise, I had to make space for them. So in one column, is the plan as is (with the revisions just posted). Then a further revision to place the 600 buses at 3100-3699. This involves giving some of the older RTS's 5 digits. Then, I finish with an alternative to give all pre-1990 buses 5 digits. That might be good, because they will soon be gone, and that would be less numbers reused in the computers (for that reason, the MTA tried 5 digits a decade ago).
ALT plan to make room for new series of 600 (second column)
3100-3699
501-530——10501-10530
601-630——10601-10608
640-763——10640-10763
5501-5550——2501-2550
3469——retire, or 13469
0001-0077
101-317
400-680
701-716
719-722
764-794
800-989
0001-0077
101-317
400-680
701-716
719-722
764-794
800-989
1000-1109
1143-1182
1183-1184
1222-1292
1294-1389
1396-1581
1600-1716
1800-1805
1860-1999
1000-1109
1143-1182
1183-1184
1222-1292
1294-1389
1396-1581
1600-1716
1800-1805
1860-1999
2000-2209
2357-2380
2421-2499
2501-2530
2551-2585
2602-2654
2705-2924
2000-2209
2357-2380
2421-2499
2501-2550
2551-2585
2602-2654
2705-2924
3000-3071
3469
3501-3550
3601-3608
3640-3763
3830-3865
3900-39993000-3071
3100-3699
3830-3865
3900-3999
4000-4899
4900-4999
4000-4899
4900-4999
5000-5834
5903-5978
5000-5834
5903-59786000-6689
6000-6689
7000-7049
7050-7073
7136-7147
7500-7809
7000-7049
7050-7073
7136-7147
7500-7809
8000-8566
8600-8703
8750-8999
8000-8566
8600-8703
8750-8999
9000-9699
9701
9801-9829
9901-9954
9000-9699
9701
9801-9829
9901-9954
10501-10530
10601-10608
10640-10763
5 DIGITS FOR ALL ABOUT TO BE RETIRED FORMER DOT BUSES:
10222-10292
10357-10380
10421-10499
10501-10530
10551-10585
10601-10608
10640-10794
10901-10954
11600-11716
12602-12654
13001-13077
So what this changes, is if I keep QT 318-399 with the same number, then COMMAND 357-380 would have to be renumbered 2357-2380 along with the other RTS's. Otherwise, I would just continue the QT series as 318-400 to 1318-1400 . With the 500's added (no conflicts), you would have a continuous series of 1294-1581
Also, you all missed the big mistake I saw when I was reviewing my printout after I posted. I missed a conflict between TTC 681-794 and GL 701-716; 719-722! So to fix this, I continued TTC 681-722 as 3681-3722. Might as well continue balance of 1986 RTS: 723-763 to 3723-3763 (total series of 3640-3763) JBS 3701 would become 9701.
So now, the revised plan looks like this:
The following buses can keep their current numbers:
GREEN: 701-716, 719-722, 1143-1182
COMMAND: 357-380 (if QT 318-399 are renumbered)
QUEENS: 318-399
TRIBORO: 681-700, 723-794, 1183-1184, 3000-3071
JAMAICA: 3830-3865 (all MTA buses with these numbers are off the property; at Nimco)
NYBS: 1600-1716, 1800-1805 (whole fleet; Fishbowls not included)
Renumbering:
(Every bus can keep its last three digits)
GREEN:
222-292——1222-1292
602-654——2602-2654,
5501-5550—— 3501-3550
COMMAND:
357-380—— 2357-2380 (optional conflict with QT 318-389)
421-499—— 2421-2499
4903-4978—— 5903-5978
QUEENS:
294-317—— 1294-1317 (might as well include balance of 1994 RTS 318-389——1318-1389)
400-581—— 1400-1581 (might as well include 396-399——1396-1399 beginning of Orions)
901-954—— 9901-9954
TRIBORO:
640-680—— 3640-3680
701-722—— 3701-3722 (might as well include 681-700—3681-3700 and 723-763—3723-3763 bal. of 1986 RTS)
2050-2073—— 7050-7073
2136-2147—— 7136-7147
2801-2829—— 9801-9829
JAMAICA:
501-530—— 2501-2530
551-585—— 2551-2585 or 3551-3585
601-608 —— 3601-3608
3701—— 9701
LIBERTY: 3001-3077—— 0001-0077
I also missed Liberty Classics 3101-3110. They do not conflict with anything now, but I did reserve 3100 and up for the new buses. So these would become 7101-7110 or 13101-13110.
On February 7th, 1984, the TA's Grumman Flxible Model 870s were permanently pulled from the streets of New York after one of them burst into flames while it was being driven back to a garage in Manhattan.
In 1985, they were still sitting in the Brooklyn Army Terminal.
Whatever became of them? When were they ultimately disposed of?
--Mark
--Mark
I remember them well as I rode them new at NYCTA/MABSTOA and a couple of times at NJT. From what I've heard NJT were quite pleased with the ex-NYCTA 870s as well as those they purchased new.
The privates (Jamaica Buses, Green Bus Lines, Triboro Coach, Queens Transit and Steinway Transit) and MSBA also had Grumman 870s. These buses served long careers on some of the same streets that NYCTA said the 870s could not handle. Jamaica Buses 870s operated 'til around '00.
When the "affected" Grumman 870s were first taken out of service by verious agencies nation-wide. There were 2,656 buses (205 at CAT, 230 at SCRTD and others) that were returned to Grumman to be retrofitted with stronger A-frames. Of all of these buses NYCTA was the only agency to claim that the buses were unsafe.
The bottom line is that NYCTA was simply full of it as they are today. Granted - we all know that Grumman 870 had their problems, but NYCTA was trying to blame them for more than they were responsible for. My question to NYCTA is: If the buses were such lemons and unsafe why is it that they operated for years elsewhere in addition to that the DOT privates which remained in service in New York City streets.
My big question remains... If the NYCTA buses were unsafe - why is it that those units at Green, Triboro, Queens/Steinway and Jamaica Buses were able to continue on in service for many more years. If anyone is wondering... yes, these buses are part of the 1013 870s - 837 for NYCTA/MABSTOA and the rest for the privates. Also - anyone here familiar with New York City in those days knows that Queens had lots of really bad streets, yet the privates' 870s mysteriously survived. Hmmmm.
I've never said (or implied) that the 870s were flawless or even close to that. I've always said that Grumman did it's part in retrofitting over 2600 defective buses and NYCTA tried ride that bandwagon to blame them for its own shortcomings.
If you look at NYCTA... they seem to have numerous problems with just about any major purchase they've made. I remmeber around the same time that had "issues" with the then new Bombardier made R-62A subway cars, but the problem went away as it usually does.
Interesting, Santa Monica Municipal Bus Lines ordered their first 47 Grummans in 1979 with 8V71, the followup order for 15 and 1981 had 6V92. The 1979s didnt work too long at SMMBL, but the 81s lasted well into the mid-90s.
On that note, I would have LOVED to see one of those in "Grand Theft Auto: Vice City". The closest thing you can get to one is either an MC-12 or what looks to be a capped MC-9. At any rate, it is an MCI concoction with a 6V92 that sounds realistic.
-F.
-F.
230 Grumman Model 870s were also removed from the streets of Los Angeles due to the same defect.
Source: Verily, A Sea of Troubles, Daily News, December 16th, 1980, page 33
--Mark
B1-#9302-NOVABUS
B64-#9329-NOVABUS
Only Jamaica Bus rebuilt theirs, the rest didn't stay around very long.
Also: LI Bus had them for quite a while.
I also saw them in the 90s at Arrow serving FoxWoods.
And saw some in Del with their public transit serving Univ of Del.
Those 870s at Tribro and Green did indeed leave sort of early, but Queens/Steinway buses stayed right into the 90's. IIRC the '94 RTS pushed them out the door.
I didn't mention MSBA as their 870s weren't part of the NYCTA order and they had had plenty of Flxible Metros.
In 1979 and 1980, the TA took possession of 637 new Grumman Flxible Model 870 buses. On November 19th, 1980, they were ordered off the streets because cracks had been discovered in 39 bus frames during routine inspections. At the time, these buses represented about 14% of the City’s bus fleet. (33) Many of these buses hadn’t seen 3 months of service. Many of the buses returned to service, but were again removed from service around December 20th. The TA also decided to dissolve an agreement for 570 additional Model 870s. Initially, Grumman rejected the ideas that the cracks were a design defect, but as the number of cracked frames increased, Grumman agreed to pay for repairs. The TA wasn’t certain that the buses could be repaired. On December 8th, 1980, the TA told Grumman to stop producing the last 200 buses in the initial 837 bus contract. The following day, the TA stopped paying Grumman for the current contract, and took steps to dissolve a $65 million follow-up order. Up to this time, the TA still owed Grumman $46 million on an $89 million contract. Grumman countered that the TA breached its contract with them by withholding payment. The Model 870s would be grounded and partially replaced by mothballed buses that were due for scrapping, but these mothballed buses were far from meeting service requirements. Waits for buses in all five boroughs skyrocketed.
The TA was forced by federal law to accept the lowest bid for the bus contract, but because of the defects, they wanted to give the contract to General Motors (for the RTS-I). However, that same law prohibited the TA from just walking away from the contract. If Grumman were unwilling to give the contract to GM, the TA would have to prove that the buses were poorly built and unsafe. If the TA succeeded in doing that, Grumman Flxible would be barred from bidding for any future bus contracts in the US.
Meahwhile, where would all the extra buses needed for daily service come from? A Christmas present from Washington, DC – that’s where! A caravan of 105 creaking old buses leased from WMATA would meander its way to New York City, with a National Guard escort, leaving Washington at 10:40am on December 27th, 1980. (35) The convoy was accompanied by extra mechanics, tow trucks, tools and truckloads of spare parts. It was hoped that the cost of the WMATA buses would be recovered from Grumman Flxible. Much of this convoy was recently returned from a stint in Philadelphia, where officials indicated that numerous breakdowns occurred. Nearly 150 MTA employees were flown to Washington, then bused to WMATA’s New Carrollton and Landover, MD shops to pick up the buses. The first WMATA bus to debut on a revenue run in New York City ran on the M106 crosstown run down 42nd Street heading east from 12th Avenue.
The MTA was considering paying Grumman the money outstanding on its contract in return for Grumman to make all necessary repairs to the 637 buses and not produce the remaining 200 buses in the contract. The TA would give the remaining bus contract to GM. Efforts to complete this agreement were fought by the City’s Comptroller, Harrison J. Goldin.
230 Grumman Model 870s were also removed from the streets of Los Angeles due to the same defect. While Grumman and Rockwell were incapable of manufacturing sturdy subway and bus equipment, they were able to manufacture satisfactory components for the space program! (34)
And why were there only two bus manufacturers in 1980, Flxible and GM? In 1971, the Federal government mandated an “ideal” bus design called “Transbus” which was very lightweight, contained sealed windows, air conditioning, a small engine and low ground clearance. The parts would be interchangeable and easily repaired. Three manufacturers built prototypes of the bus, then indicated they would never build another. The federal government, realizing that their good intentions for an ideal bus would never see the light of day, accepted the Model 870 and the RTS-I as compromises. The Feds left it up to the manufacturers to choose the materials they would use to meet the Transbus requirements. The materials Flxible chose could not stand up to the punishing streets of New York City. In order for cities to obtain 80% in federal Urban Mass Transportation Administration (UMTA) grants, they were forced to purchase either the Model 870 or the RTS – any other bus would not be federally funded. When GM and Flxible bid for the MTA’s bus contract, Flxible was the lower bidder, and the MTA was mandated by law to accept the lowest bid. The MTA never liked the Model 870, but Flxible was no longer manufacturing the old style buses that the MTA was used to. (36)
In 1982, the MTA was exploring the purchase of new buses from the Hino Company of Japan and Renault of France. The contract would be for 325 buses per year for 5 years.
On February 7th, 1984, David Gunn, on his 5th day as the TA president, ordered all of the Model 870s grounded after one of them burst into flames while it was being driven back to a garage in Manhattan. (61) They never returned to service again. The MTA tried to sell the buses while they were in storage at the Brooklyn Army Terminal. As of 1985, there were no buyers. The TA sued Grumman for $324 million in damages citing fraud; Grumman countersued for $1 billion citing poor maintenance as the reason for the Flxible’s failures. The MTA had to repay the federal government the funding it provided - $56 million – by July 1st, 1984.
This wasn’t the end though. The MTA purchased a number of new double-decker buses to run down 5th Avenue. Someone forgot to measure the clearance from overhead traffic lights. The buses didn’t stay there for long.
So do you know how long the buses sat at the Brooklyn Army Terminal (a year is sufficient, I don't need an exact date). And can anyone provide me more details on the double decker buses that couldn't fit under several of the traffic lights along 5th Avenue?
--Mark
12/13/80-NYC grounded 637 Grumman buses and SCRTD had grounded 230.
12/26/80-CTA in chicago grouded 205 Grummans.
mid march 1981-after the retrofit,the grummans returned to service.
I too remember the WMATA buses. They ran on the S6(now the S66) route in Staten Island.
--Mark
(And I do remember hearing about issues with stuff overhead. Apparently that's why they only ran on the M4 and M5.)
--Mark
I don't know if you saw this before, but here is a photo of one on the X15.
--Mark
Dr. Ebert’s book also offers an excellent history of the U.S. transit bus manufacturers during the 1970’s Transbus program and following developments. The cancellation of the Transbus program and the adoption of the ADB design specs did force AM General out of the transit bus business, but it also indirectly led to manufacturers like Flyer, GM-Canada, Orion, Gillig and others to enter the industry when many transit authorities balked and refused to buy ADB’s.
The Flxible book was published by Antique Power – a link to their website is here (look under ‘Gift Shop’ to find the books) - http://www.antiquepower.com/index.html
Jim D.
Thanks so much for your post. I didn't have all the fact, but for a long time I've also mentioned that Grumman made the necessary repairs to the Grumman 870 and incorporated the strengthened -A-Frame in later buses. ...and that the TA's problems were the result of their lack of decent maintenance. I didn't know about the shock absorber, but I'm not suprised as TA buses were really bad in those days.
What's also interesting is that David Gunn removed these buses from service and later went on to head WMATA which purchased hundreds of Flxible Metros. Go figure.
The fire in the Flxible was probably the "last straw" in the decision to remove them from service permanently. I don't have any doubts that TA maintenance practices at the time contributed to the fire and the buses' eventual removal; mean distnace betwen failures for subway cars was hovering aroung 6,600 miles, so why would anyone expect the bus situation to be any different.
--Mark
"On February 3, 1984, on West 57th Street in Manhattan, a major media event occurred that provided impetus for the NYCTA to junk its Flxible 870's. A fire destroyed a Model 870 that was carrying no passengers; no one was injured. Subsequently, NYCTA President David Gunn admitted that improper maintenance was responsible for the fire. Grumman engineers confirmed that the bus was being operated without one of its rear shock absorbers. The top mounting pin for that shock absorber was missing, which permitted the trough that separated the fuel lines from the electrical cables to drop down and eventually wear through the fuel lines and electrical cables to provide the spark and fuel that ignited the fire. Before Grumman was allowed to inspect the bus, the whole 870 fleet was termed junk by New York Mayor Ed Koch and ordered out of service by Mr. Gunn."
Jim D.
Ray
So there's a Flxible going the opposite direction so the bus I need will be coming just now so then 858 arrives at the Harrison stop and its a mellow ride, to put it best. Then after doing a mild lean around a curve, the sky turns GRAY AND STARTS A HEAVY DOWNPOUR so for the people who didn't have umbrellas [I had one] it was real tough for them. So I get off in the New Rochelle area where I wait for the 45 and I see 819 on the 42 so since the rain was getting worse I considered taking it but then I was like nah so I let it go then 5 minutes later my bus came. An interesting tidbit was that 15-20 were under one bus shed to keep themselves from getting wet and/or sick later on. I get on Neoplan 519 and its a cool ride and on the Hutch River Parkway there was some police activity but nothing major then I arrive at Pelham Bay Park and see quite a few Artics on the Bx5 and Bx12. Still raining out so I wait about 10 minutes for any bus ot show up then LTD bus 5314 arrives and we depart.
I noticed that the bus had RING written on the Stop Requested bell and had leaks in 3 different places that I saw in the bus. A good ride along Pelham Parkway and East Fordham Rd on the LTD until I reach my stop at Fordham Plaza and I get on 5411 on the Bx55
and its an ok ride although the Bx15 in front of us beat us all the way to 149 St and we caught up to 5375, the bus in front of us. I ride 1083 on the Bx19 via 145/149 crosstown to St Nicholas Av for the A train to 59 St where I take the B and finish my trip.
A few pics:
Enjoy!
O7 7575 B8
R40 4290 (B)
R142 1200 (4)
Bee Line Neoplan 540 #20
Bee Line Flx 825 #5
Bee Line Flx 858 #61
Bee Line Neoplan 519 #45
NF Artic 5314 Bx12
NF Artic 5411 Bx55
NF Artic 1083 Bx19
R38 3953 (A)
R40M 4524 (B)
Of all the White Plains to Bronx routes (1W, 3, 20/21, 40/41, 60/62), I enjoy riding the 41 the most (although there are only 5 trips from 4 to 5:20 PM), and it's the fastest express bus. The 3 is a nice scenic ride, but it depends on the operator on which highway they use. Most times it's the Sprain Brook, although the NY State Thruway between White Plains and Tuckahoe was used on occasion.
Sorry Q-Traindash7 and NIMBY, I enjoy Bee-Line much more than LI Bus. :-)
Some ideas:
4 train to Bedford Park or Woodlawn, then 20/21 bus up. Back down on 3 bus to Van Cortlandt Park for your 1/9 train.
5 to last stop (Dyre), then walk down to Boston Road and Conner St for 60 bus. Take 60 to White Plains and return on a different bus.
NOTE: The 41 express goes to East 241st St, however almost all 40 local buses only end at Mount Vernon East (New Haven RR) station.
...
Queens is shortchanged in bus service. We have the oldest busses, the longest waits, the most breakdowns.
We've had enough!
We ask that you sign the petition, download and distribute materials in your community and keep up with the news. You can do all that on this web site by clicking on the section links above to the left.
The person (or people) who put this together want to guarantee that no route will ever be eliminated (regardless of whether or not people use it or it provides a service that customers need) or that service will never be reduce (regardless of whether or not it is needed, or the buses or personnel assigned to that route could be better used on other routes).
Am I correct in that assumption?
If so, there are several points that I need to make:
1) That's a privilege not currently extended to NYCT's current customers. The right to have a bus route forever, obviously, is not a constitutional right, nor is any schedule carved in stone. Service has to be provided to meet customers' needs.
2) Beyond that, if you can't decrease service on less-used routes, you can't increase service where it's needed, nor can you create new routes to meet new needs. Why run a service that mainly exists to connect with a ferry line that stopped operating more than half a century ago?
3) Locked in schedules--no possibility of changes. Gee, that sounds like what the private bus lines have now. I supposed that their customers like the set-up that they have now.
In fact, the MTA is asking for a blank check to eliminate or change our bus routes and service without any public or
legislative review.
The statement bears witness to the change in pending legislation that would no longer require the MTA/RBA ho hold public commentary sessions or solicit legislative review.
A few years ago, when Green Bus eliminated a few of their routes, did any kind of public hearing take place? No.
The MTA wants to change current legislation that gives the people who utilize and pay for their bus system by removing the right to attend public hearings about such plans. They also wish to remove the very piece of legislation which currently prohibits them from doing such with new legislation, effectively, giving them carte-blanche to do with surface transportation as they deem appropriate without due course or process.
The website in reference supports current legislation, giving you, the people of the city and users of the system the right to be heard. Is it your contention and position that you're willing to give up that right? Because based upon your sentiments, that's what you're indicating.
Regarding your reference to elected officials feeling one way or another, the elected officials are in opposition of the current bill proposed by the MTA for the reasons indicated above.
Pay closer attention to what's going on if you wish your opinions to be taken seriously.
Currently, NYCT customers have the opportunity to speak out and act on service and schedule changes. The private bus customers do not. When Green Bus cuts a route or a schedule, what can their customers do?
I do pay very close attention, and I have a better idea of what I am talking about than you do.
Let's review:
Re: "SOS Queens" Save Our Service Posted by Yorkie on Thu Jun 3 19:02:48 2004
Now let me see if I have this straight. The person (or people) who put this together want to guarantee that no route will ever be eliminated (regardless of whether or not people use it or it provides a service that customers need) or that service will never be reduce (regardless of whether or not it is needed, or the buses or personnel assigned to that route could be better used on other routes). Am I correct in that assumption?
You are incorrect in your original statement above, as I'd indicated time and again. The person (or people) who put this together want to guarantee that no route will ever be eliminated or that service will be reduced upon an MTA takeover and/or Regional Bus implementation system WITHOUT PRIOR PUBLIC NOTICE AND HEARING AS IS CURRENT LEGISLATION. That same legislation that requires the MTA to hold public hearings when closing subway stations.
If so, there are several points that I need to make:
Your following points are moot, based solely on your misunderstanding of the above, and the fact that you persist in reiterating how much you're following the situation, yet don't seem to comprehend what you're reading. However, for the sake of argument, I'll entertain them. Once.
1) That's a privilege not currently extended to NYCT's current customers. The right to have a bus route forever, obviously, is not a constitutional right, nor is any schedule carved in stone. Service has to be provided to meet customers' needs.
Nowhere, anywhere, has anyone ever indicated, suggested, implied, stated or offered that any bus route should remain forever. The priveledge that IS currently extended to NYCT's customers has been outlined above. Please read it closely and carefully to absorb the message.
2) Beyond that, if you can't decrease service on less-used routes, you can't increase service where it's needed, nor can you create new routes to meet new needs. Why run a service that mainly exists to connect with a ferry line that stopped operating more than half a century ago?
Again, no inference to prohibition of decreasing service has been submitted.
3) Locked in schedules--no possibility of changes. Gee, that sounds like what the private bus lines have now. I supposed that their customers like the set-up that they have now.
I can't speak for Green Lines customer base. Can you?
You then went on to say:
Re: "SOS Queens" Save Our Service Posted by Yorkie on Thu Jun 3 23:17:57 2004
The point is that "SOS Queens" appears, to me, seems to be against anyone even being able to do that. Certainly some of the elected officials feel that way.
You appear to have created a scenerio in your mind that doesn't exist, and proceed to argue your point which also doesn't exist. Basically, you're arguing with yourself because to date, you haven't grasped the concept of that simple piece of verbage.
Minor schedule changes are not a cause for hearings at MTA or DOT.
The "white with the red line" is Triboro Coach.
BTW, no one with rullers has been here.
For more photos can be found at:
Rochester
Fast Ferry Terminal Photos
Ray
Queens Surfice will be in very good hands.
I heard that some changes in Brooklyn Dispatchers Post will be made effective the coming pick which begins the end of June.
All i can say is that depot changes will be made for the September pick if the information i heard today is true.
Thats all i can say
Thank You
David
BIG AL
Bush Terminal · Croxton Yard · Doreumus Avenue · E-Rail · ExpressRail (Dockside) · Greenville Yard · Land Bridge Terminal (Resources Warehouse) · Little Ferry · North Bergen · Oak Island (Canadian Pacific) · Oak Island (Conrail) · Pacer Stacktrain · Ridgefield Heights Auto Terminal · South Kearny
Bush Terminal
NY Regional Rail (NY Cross Harbor RR)
4302 First Avenue
Brooklyn, NY 11232
Tel: (718) 788-3690
Fax: (718) 788-4462
Web site: www.nyrr.com
e-mail: nyrr@mindspring.com
Located on the Brooklyn waterfront, the Bush Terminal is a specialized intermodal facility operated by NY Regional Rail (formerly NY Cross Harbor RR). Bush Terminal is equipped with a float bridge for the loading of rail cars on barges.
Trains from here cross on ferrys from Oak Island Bayonee bridge Yard.
Never met a railfan who got a ride on this but if you do email this list to tell me how it went. The Cross Harbor Railroad is curently on the hot seat
with New Yorks Famouse Over bearing regulations(Did not Bribe the right people)
so they may or may not be in buisness.
Croxton (North Jersey) Yard
125 County Road
Jersey City, NJ 07307
Tel: (201) 239-3242
Fax: (201) 239-3237
Hours: 24 hours/day, except Saturday and Sunday, the terminal is closed from 2 p.m. to 10 p.m
Croxton, also known as North Jersey Intermodal Terminal, is a Norfolk Southern full-service terminal designed specifically for double-stack service.
This is a high security facillity so enter with ID and or at your own risk
Doremus Avenue Auto Terminals
861 Doremus Avenue
Newark, NJ 07114
Tel: (973) 578-4884
Fax: (973) 578-4101
Hours: 6 a.m.- 6 p.m., seven days a week.
These are the largest rail automobile loading facilities in the New York/New Jersey region. These are Conrail (NS/CSX Shared Asset) terminals, located adjacent to the north side of Port Newark, at NJ Turnpike Interchange 14.
-This is Jersey so best to stay out of this one as well-
E-Rail
Rail Bridge Terminals Inc.
322 Third Street
Elizabeth, NJ 07206
Tel: (908) 588-0343
Fax: (908) 351-9037
Hours: Seven days, 24 hours.
This rail facility is located just south of the Port Authority’s Elizabeth Marine Terminal along the Chemical Coast rail line. It is operated by the Rail Bridge Corp., a subsidiary of K-Line, and is served by Norfolk Southern. It provides transcontinental “double-stack service.
This is the starting points for Stack Trains to make there Epic 5-8 Day journey Cross Country--Fairly acessible by foot-Not very accesble by car
ExpressRail (Dockside)
E. Fleet Street
Elizabeth, NJ 07201
Tel: (908) 527-0147
Fax: (908) 527-0350
Hours: 7 a.m.-5 p.m., Monday - Friday
Provides daily double-stack train service between the Port and points in the Midwest, Eastern Canada and beyond. The terminal is served directly by CSX and Norfolk Southern. Canadian cargo is transferred to CP Rail at Selkirk, N.Y.
(back)
Greenville Yard
Port Jersey
Jersey City, N.J.
Conrail Operations (double-stack, vehicles)
New York Regional Railroad
4302 First Ave.
Brooklyn, NY 11232
Tel: (718) 788-3690
Fax: (718) 788-4462
This specialized rail yard, located on the Jersey City, N.J., waterfront, is served by the New York Regional Railroad (formerly NY Cross Harbor RR) and Conrail (joint NS/CSX). Conrail interchanges traffic to/from NYRR, which operates the car float “service between Greenville and Brooklyn.
(back)
Land Bridge Terminal (Resources Warehouse)
2200 Secaucus Road
North Bergen, NJ 07047
Tel: (201) 348-6300
Fax: (201) 348-6262
Web site: www.resources-warehouse.com
e-mail: Precon@resources-warehouse.com
This is a multiple-service intermodal center located along the New York, Susquehanna & Western RR in North Bergen, N.J. The facility can load and unload double-stack trains as well as provide warehousing and container freight station services.
(back)
Little Ferry
CSX Intermodal
2200 83rd Street
North Bergen, N.J. 07047
Tel: (201) 902-1003
Fax: (201) 902-1002
Hours: Seven days, 24 hours.
Little Ferry is a CSX Intermodal facility that is also served by the New York Susquehanna & Western RR. Located near the George Washington Bridge and the NJ Turnpike Interchange 18, the terminal handles import/export, mini-landbridge and domestic traffic, including double-stack container service.
(back)
North Bergen Yard
6201 Tonnelle Avenue
North Bergen, NJ 07047-3311
Tel: (201) 941-9530
Hours: 24 hours a day/7 days a week
North Bergen is a CSX yard that provides high-speed connections between the New York/New Jersey region and destinations ranging from upstate New York to the U.S. Midwest and the West Coast.
(back)
Oak Island Terminal (Conrail)
Newark, NJ 07114
Contact: Conrail Operations Center
1100 Howard Boulevard
Mt Laurel, NJ 08054
Tel: (609) 231-2000
(back)
Oak Island (Canadian Pacific)
91 Bay Avenue
Newark, NJ 07105
Tel: (973) 465-1333
Fax: (973) 465-1417
Oak Island is located just north of the PortNewark/Elizabeth marine terminal complex. It is convenient to U.S. Rt. 1/9 and the N.J. Turnpike at Interchange 14. Oak Island is Canadian Pacific’s main terminal in the New York/New Jersey region.
Pacer Stacktrain
American President Corporation
123 Pennsylvania Avenue
S. Kearny, NJ 07032
Tel: (973) 465-5920
Fax: (973) 589-6234
This is a Conrail (NS/CSX Shared Asset) terminal that primarily handles domestic container and double-stack mini-landbridge service for Pacer. It is adjacent to the CSX S. Kearny Terminal.
(back)
Ridgefield Heights Auto Terminal
Victoria Terrace
Ridgefield, NJ 07657
Tel: (201) 941-5023
Fax: (201) 941-5043
Hours: Sun.-Fri., 5 a.m. to midnight
This automobile facility, located along the CSX River Line, is served by Norfolk Southern and CSX.
(back)
South Kearny
700 Old Fish House Road
South Kearny, NJ 07032-4304
Tel: (973) 274-2400
Fax: (973) 274-2455
Hours: 24 hours a day/7 days a week
South Kearny is a CSX terminal handling both TOFC and double-stack container service. It offers frequent service linking the New York/New Jersey region with points throughout the United States.
(back)
OK?
As for this mutant, I'm sure Senator/President Kelly will find this and take "necessary action." ;-)
I saw a face similar to that at the AMC movie theatre on 42nd Street in Manhattan.
Long live the extra long exhaust pipe! I have to look out for this bus when I'm in MD...you've got to see it to believe it.
-Fred
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
I was on a Q34 today, and I asked the driver for a Continuing Trip Ticket, but he did not know what I was talking about. How can someone transfer between the Q25 and Q34, like if a person was going from College Point to Willets Point for free since I believe if you try to use a metrocard, it will charge you another fare, or if you use a paper magnetic white and blue transfer, it will be rejected??
Thanks.
What still perplexes me about that game is that there are NO transits to be found. A simple RTS, Fishbowl, or Flxible Metro would be nice.
-F.
Is there ANY transit agency that dumps people into the street?!
-F.
But for those of us that are old enough:
In GTA: III, there are no set bus routes. Depending on where you are, buses will be randomly generated and will follow random routes.
As for bus stops, there are two. One is on Staunton Island not too far from the casino, and the other is by Francis International Airport. Suspiciously, the signs look like NYC bus stop signs for the M1, M2, and M3.
In GTA: VC, there's a bus route for the eastern island, and a bus route for the western island, and each route has bus stops along the way which are marked by signs (remember, you can drive the bus to the stops and pick up and discharge passengers to make a little money). Ironically, the bus stop signs used in VC are the same as the ones from III, so they're all Manhattan signs for the M1, 2, and 3.
It'd be a little difficult to describe the exact routing of the buses, so just find one, and follow it to learn the route.
Perhaps if the AI were bit more advanced, they'd start cursing you out for blocking the bus, and then the cops would arrive and beat you down for blocking a No Standing Zone.
-F.
*BSU: Blowing Sh(aving cream) Up!
Then I hop on 294 on the Q34 and the Stop Requested bell didn't light whenever you pulled the cord but you would hear the *ding*, pretty interesting. I get off at Jewel Av and I just missed the Q65A but its frequent in the rush so 3 minutes later a cold 492 arives and take the short ride ot the last stop and shortly after I get 483, which is a slow dog but after 20mph the speed would kick in so the skies turn very gray and I notice that it will rain once again so at Sanford Av I see Viking 997 on the x51. By time I reach Flushing it starts to drizzle and I see a full wrap of 355 promoting Harry Potter and the newest movie. Take some more pics & I walk over to the Q66 stop and wait for the Long Island City bus, get on 447 and stopped at every bus stop until the lower 80's then its more of a quick ride afterwards then I see a Q101 coming so I get off and to my surprise 404 has a John Deere engine!
Basically it has rapid accel and I get off at Queens Plaza and I wait 15-20 minutes for the Q67 and its funny seeing people run for the Q32's that were passing by. Sun is out once again and I get on 384 and its all good at first but then we start to accelerate slower as the trip progressed and on 53 Drive, we barely went 10mph up the hill so something was going wrong I suppose. Anyway its a 1/2 hour ride to Metro Av and I catch 8137 on the Q54 and take the trip to Willy-B Plaza and get on 8317 on the B46 LTD and its a good ride although we ran ahead of time at St Johns Pl but otherwise a good ride then I get off at Avenue D and ride on a frosty 922 on the B8 and finish my trip.
Now add 2 more buses to the FB fleet: 4684 and 8194.
R68 2792 (Q)
R46 5954 (F)
QSC RTS 342 Q102
QSC RTS 347 Q104
QSC RTS 328 Q66
QSC RTS 294 Q34
QSC O5 492 Q65A
QSC O5 483 Q65
QSC O5 447 Q66
QSC O5 404 Q101
QSC RTS 384 Q67
RTS 8137 Q54
RTS 8317 B46 LTD
NF 922 B8
Enjoy!
As they say nothing runs like a deer ... QSC has two of them.
Next time try an express via LIE or Queensboro Bridge, you'll enjoy the view.
Wonder if they're out of the loop now.
Disclaimer: I am not affiliated with the MTA, any bus company or the body shop.
I repeat this is my speculation only:
EAST NEW YORK-B7,B8,B12,B14,B15,B20(entire Route),Q24,B25,B45,B47,B49,B51,Q56,B60,B83
JACKIE GLEASON-B9,B11,B16,B23,X27,B35,B37,B43,B48,B61,B63,B65,B67,B68,B69,B70,B71,B75,B77
FLATBUSH-B2/100,B31,Q35,B41,B44,B46,BM-1,BM-4
ULMER PARK-B1,B3,B4,B6(ALL),X25,X28,X29,B36,B64,B74,BM-3
FRESH POND-B13,B24,B26,B38,Q38,B39,Q39,B52,B54,Q54,Q55,B57,Q58,Q59,Q67
SPRING CREEK(CURRENT COMMAND DEPOT)B17,B42,B82,B103,BM-2,BQM-1
Any commnets
Again this is my speculation only
Thank You
JAMAICA-Q4,Q5,Q8,Q17,Q42,Q60,X64,Q77,Q84,Q85
CASEY STENGEL-Q12,Q13,Q14,Q15,Q16,Q20,Q26,Q27,Q28,Q44,Q48,X51,Q74,Q76,QBX 1(Queens/Bronx part only)
QUEENS VILLAGE-Q1,Q2,Q30,Q31,Q36,Q43,Q46,X68,Q75,Q79,Q83,Q88,Q110
ROCKAWY BLVD(Current Green Line)Q3,Q6,Q7,Q9,Q9A,Q10,Q11,Q21,Q22,Q22AQ37,Q40,Q41,Q53,QM15,QM16,QM17,QM18,QM23
FARMERS BLVD(Curent Jamaica Bus)X63,Q111,Q112,Q113,QM21
The Q-32 from Stengel will be moved to Queens Surfice)Queens Surfice and Triboro routes will be in another division. This is the current TA Queens Division only.
Any comments
Again this is my speculation only
Thank You
If Regional Bus does pass legislation, the point is moot because you won't have a bus running anywhere.
The postings are my own without consulting with any one in the TA.
In regards to Regional Bus i do not think its going to pass but the takeover can still happen under current law.
Thank You
Anyone who says otherwise is lying or simply doesn't know the facts.
*If established fairly, using existing contracts, keeping as many current non-represented employees as possible and updating the fleet as well as increasing service where it's needed.
Thank You
Because they need to be invited first.
Mayor Mike seems to have the mushroom theory, i.e. keep them in the dark
The unions were not invited to the table where the NYCDOT and MTA set forth regulations described in a "Term Sheet" agreed upon without union input (or knowledge).
I cant wait for the other QSC and Triboro Routes, I wont be surprised to see 126th or MJQ involved in this.
The MTA can plan anything they wish. They can plan to send a bus to Mars if they choose. Nothing will be done without the unions approval. To date, only the SSSA have responded that RBA is negotiable. To all other unions, RBA is non-negotiable.
MetroB
BIG AL
MetroB
BIG AL
BIG AL
"Dispatcher (pee-on)"
So I'm assuming you don't like dispatchers?
MetroB
BIG AL
MetroB
Dispatcher (pee-on) - Normal Nose
Superintendant - Light Brown Nose
Assistant Geneneral Supt - Brown Nose
General Supt - Dark Brown Nose
Assistant General Manager - Black Nose
General Manager - No Nose Remaining
Big business has successfully reduced management layers through technology. In fact the greatest loser in the technology revolution was not the line worker but the middle manager whose job was made obsolete by technolgy
the same should be done at the ta
L M A O
BIG AL
Thanl You
BIG AL
IF YOU CAN READ THIS....
.....FLIP ME OVER!!!
-F.
Here's the basic HTML code to use for posting a link to this board:
<a href="LINK_URL_HERE_BETWEEN_QUOTES_NO_SPACES">Name of your link, description of your link or the actual URL. Spaces are allowed.</a>
Example A: <a href="http://www.hopetunnel.org/bus/040418/5123.jpg">Name of your link, description of your link or the actual URL. Spaces are allowed.</a>
Example B: <a href="http://www.hopetunnel.org/bus/040418/5123.jpg">http://www.hopetunnel.org/bus/040418/5123.jpg</a>
Da Hui
For remote linking to Image Station, remove the ".orig.jpg" extension. This will display the smaller version of the image. You corrected the display URL in your next post.
Let me know if it can be seen or not.
Da Hui
Second Avenue Stubway
-Fred
-Fred
-Fred
B1-#4787-TMC
B9-#7598-Orion VII
B100-#369-GMCRTSII-04
David
Basically the Command Bus and the Queens Surfice Management will be allowed on the property after July 1st only to begin the process of closing down the companies.
Having closed my own business in 1994 you just can't walk out on June 30th and be out of business on July 1st. It does not work like that.
Taxes have to be paid,W-2 forms for 2004 will have to be issued, The pension funds have to be transferred, Companies will have to settle the accounts with the DOT etc.
It took me six weeks to close my textile business its going to take the companies that will be going out several months.
I really doubt that the DOT and the MTA will throw them out on July 1st especially the Queens Surfice staff which i believe have no other business interests. I am sure that a reasonable time will be given for the companies to shut down. Most likely the Command management will be moved over to Green Lines since Green Lines owns Command Bus.
Thats my opinion
Thank You
I already got two "Warn" letter from the boss that says July 1st I no longer work for her.
-F.
~Black magic isn't always a bad thing...("inside" joke)
-Fred
-F.
Since Jackie Gleason can handle between 330 & 340 buses & since it has 317 buses right now, add another route to Jackie Gleason & still keep it as a CNG facility & still keep the express buses at Ulmer Park.
Thart would free up space for the MTA to move the BM3 and BM4 command express routes to UP. These line begin 5 min down the belt parkway from UP vs. a 20 minute ride from the current command facility.
Such a move would save some labor and fuel costs
David
47 BETHESDA
47 VIA
47 MONT. MALL
As we left the mall, the driver actually changed the sign so it would just say
47 BETHESDA
It was the first time I had seen a driver do that, though I knew the sign existed and I have seen drivers who just left the 47 BETHESDA sign up the entire run. Has anyone else seen the drivers do this? I wonder how many even know the code is programmed in because on the September 03 run sheets, the sign code for the run that starts at Montgomery Mall in the early AM is for the VIA reading and the list of codes has been removed from all the buses as far as I can tell.
Then, due to 355 being closed somewhere between Medical Center and Grosvenor, 46s were on the following detour:
Southbound
Normal to 355 & Tuckerman
R on Tuckerman
L on Old Georgetown
L on Battery
L on Woodmont
L on 355
L into station
Reverse for northbound
No mention of how drivers were to serve Grosvenor Station but I am sort of glad I didn't take the 37.
Then, once at Bethesda, I saw 5910 start a 70 run and I saw a 35 footer IIRC doing the 70 run before that one. Service was incerased as part of Go Montgomery Phase I so how many buses does the 70 now require?
West Farms
7655-7683, 7686-7688, 7690-7692, 7694, 7698-7699, 7702, 7704, 7706-7707, 7710-7732, 7734-7738, 7740-7742, 7747-7748, 7755
Hale
6365-6372, 6375, 6382, 6384, 6387
(6365 & 6366 @ Orion Plant)
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
-Adam
fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com
Da Hui
Da Hui
Orion's manufactering process is a 2 step process. The shell is manufactered in Mississuaga,Canada. The shell is then shipped to Oriskany, NY, where the rest of the bus gets assembled and completed. Not to mention that MTA is NOT Orion's only customer and Orion Does have other customers to take care of. New Flyer I believe has a one step manufactering process on one property. Some manufacters have the ability and facilities to produce buses at a greater rate than other manufacterers.
Those "Buy it in our state" things are shortsighted attempts by politcos to make sure that the money spent by the state gets spent in their area of concern. This is pork barrel politics at it's best and it often results in lax quality and over paying for things that could be purchased on the US market much cheaper. This can be seen time and time again. LIRR's DM30ACs were assembled like shit because Super Steel Schenectady had no reason to fear retribution. They make a damn good train when bidding competetively (they've assembled EMD locos for Conrail, UP, CSX and NS), but when they were assured a contract, they had no motivation. The same thing happened in Seattle with two classes of ferryboats and again with Super Steel, gawd knows where your Rhor Turbos are. Orion sees that nobody else is in the same position as they are and they slack off on the new york orders, since they are quite assured to get the next contract.
Yeah I too would like to see the TA [well the state to] end this buy New York shit too and perhaps give some new competitors [besides New Flyer]. Lets see what happens in the future.....
Actually, just as well, if not better.
Trevor
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
(The best Flxibles in the entire fleet, but they are on their last legs as we speak)
30-35: 1987(?) Flxible 30096-6T
DD 6V92TA/Allison V731
36-40: Flxible 30096-6C
Cummins L10/Voith D863
4291-4791: 1991 Flxible 30096-6C
Cummins L10/Voith D863
6791,6891: 1991 Flxible 40096-6C
Cummins L10/Voith D863
6198-6698: 1998 Thomas TL-960 Transitliner
Cummins C8.3/Allison B400R (?)
7001-7791: 2001 Gillig Phantom
Cummins ISM/Allison B400R
Soon to arrive:
8004-8704(?): 2004 Gillig Advantage
I am merely guessing about the fleet #'s. Most likely they will have a Cummins ISM/Allison B400R.
There's a few Startrans and Champion cutaways numbered in the 20's and 50's which are used for nighttime security and low ridership routes, but they're not worth mentioning:)
-Fred
Da Hui
Da Hui
Oh wait, that's right, you have a shitty D390, you can't change settings on that POS!
So on the Queen-B we are moving at an unusually sluggish pace but it turns out that there was a yellow cab whose hood refused to stay down and it nearly ran into the steel railings on the side so that limited us to one lane for 1/2 the distance. That is not too bad but on the LIE was gridlock as usual so I watch all of the OOS express buses roll by heading towards Manhattan and it takes a good while to ge through this leg of the trip. Then we manage to go at the speed limit briefly before we hit the surface streets again on Main St and I get off at Union St, walk back to Kissena Blvd to get some photos and something to eat. I see 8240 on the Q17 LTD and a couple of O5's and such then I run to get 401 on the Q12 and its a cool ride and I see a D4500 and Viking pass my bus on Sanford Av. I take the ride via Northern to Bell Blvd to wait for the Q31, which takes about 12 minutes to come and the inside of 620 was just horrid.
When I sat down there was litter all over, scratchiti [not on the windows], torn seats, green foam on the floor and a bad smell that persisted as we went along. Overall the ride was cool and mellow but then that smell got stronger so by Utopia Pkwy the bus goes OOS and it turns out that there was a leak from the back so we get on 9355 on the Q30 and continue along our way. A funny thing was that these kids who were also on the Q31 looked like the knew nothing about the 30 since they thought it went elsewhere besides Jamaica; which in fact does not of course. I take the E from Parsons Blvd to 7 Av where I hop on a R42 B and finish my trip.
NF 854 B8
RTS 9390 B49
Command O5 4941 BM3
Viking 997 x51
O5 401 Q12
O5 620 Q31
R32 3809 (E)
R42 4942 (B)
Enjoy!
The second one is MTA's Viking waiting for a run on the X51. The TA only has 3 of them-all operate out of Casey Stengal Depot on the X51.
I think the Viking looks cool.
9702 A12 Addison Road
2053 C21 Prince George's Community College
63038 21 New Carrolton
2035 T18 Rhode Island Avenue
3901 D8 Union Station
8843 N22 Navy Yard
9388 P2 Federal Triangle
2171 S2 the Old Convention Center
2444 80 North Capitol and H Streets
5243 X2 Minnesota Avenue
2389 U2 Anacostia
2410 B2 Barney Circle
4078 34 7th and Independence
2190 54 F streets
-here is where I nearly got Fabioized. While waiting for the 42 to come, about 3 pigeons nearly flew into me. I get the feeling THE BUS sent them:P . I don't look like Fabio so why were they trying to fly into me. Along with those near run in with the pigeons, one pigeon was trying to get his mac-on with another pigeon, but he got shot down. I have a couple of jokes but I am too tired to say them.
8842 42 Farragut Square
-this is a Southern bus, how I could tell, easily, it had a smarttrip fare box, which apparently wasn't working(WhyMATA at work). I want to know if this was just a borrowed bus or is this going to become a regular thing. Like with the 97, I thought that they only ran buses from Bladensburg and Northern, not knowing they ran one or two runs from the Annex.
4033 42 National Cathedral
4345rehab 35 Friendship Heights
5513 11 Silver Spring
2127 Q2 Wheaton
5821 48 Rockville
5821 55 Lakeforest(not a typo, got the same bus consecutively
5556 57 Shady Grove
2131 Q2 Rockville
5584 47 Montgomery Mall
2132 J2 Bethsda( I am getting sick of these *&%$#@? buses, like B-mores NABIs)
5718 34 Wheaton
5211 Y9 Silver Spring station(missed the last F4, so decided to take the subway and see if I could meet the F4 at PG Plaza, not happenin Cap'n)
Breda Red Fort Totten
CAF Green L'Enfant Plaza
Rohr Blue Addison Road
4271rehab A12 somewhere close to home
other observations:
saw 4277 rehabbed with orange sign and 4201 almost freshly rehabbed complete with orange sign.
4086 approached on the P6 to the Metro Center stop, I looked at it a bit then noticed, this sucker has at least right side LED turn signals. Add this one to the oddity files.
Oh yea by the way, left house around 7am didn't get back till 11:45pm. As much as I like bus riding, I ain't doing this no more, esepically with the PG bus service, the attempting 31 bus rides that is, going back to normal bus tripping next week.
First... Happy B-Day to you. Well even though you didn't quite make 31 buses - you made a good effort. It's not a bad idea, but I sure I would've stopped once I passed age 35. I didn't realize how late you were out until you mentioned missing the last F4. BTW - I have the 24th if the trip is still on.
One certain thing about the RTS's at SEPTA, they were the most altered buses in the entire fleet, getting 4 [one group had 5] alterations throughout their career.
The first alteration [1984-85] was the installation of the Sutrak AC's on the roof of the buses. SEPTA felt that it was much simpler than squar-backing the 03 models to look like the 04 buses.
The second and third alterations came in 1988-89 came with the repowering of the buses. Originally, they had 6v71 engines[except 8265-84 but I did not know what engines they had, I guess it was 8v71], but they were slow and underpowered, so SEPTA repowered them with 6v92TA engines. Also the 2 piece mylar curtain signs were taken out for dot-matrix signs. [ 4458-70 had two conversions of their destination signs. They went from one-piece to two piece when the buses were moved from Frontier to Victory, then they got the electronic signs during the 88-89 GOH].
The last alteration was the removal of the touch bars on the rear doors [on CTD buses only], altering door controls so that the operator controls the doors [that was also applied to the Neoplan and Volvo buses as well].
My only question was this: The SEPTA RTS was an 03 slopeback model. I remember having a sales brochure from GM which introduced the RTS 04 model, so were the SEPTA RTS the last 03's made?
Removal as in taken out, or just inoperable? The neoplans touch bars weren't removed, they just stopped have any functionality other than holding on to it while standing since it was turned into operator controlled rear doors(i'm guessing largely due to lawsuits, and inability to reopen them).
~RIP DKs
I wonder what the deal is. Not liek it matters, I liked the bars.
Those who post to the other message board on this site probably already know the answer to this one, so I'll leave it to the folks who exclusively post to BusTalk.
Ding! Ding! Ding!
We have a winner!
The bus is located at 37th Road & Broadway.
The elevated train structure you refer to is the Manhattan-bound platform of the 74th Street-Broadway staion on the 7 line. The bus itself is running on the Q47 route. The windscreen/wall is being removed from the platform and will eventually be replaced by something like what already appears on the opposite platform.
(Yikes! A subway picture on a bus message board!)
Now where's this one?
Next picture please
Da Hui
Da Hui
Please give me some time, like an hour.
Take your time!
Last call...
Hints:
It is Queens.
It was a holiday.
"The City Never Sleeps"...
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Peace,
ANDEE
I saw this bus on Broadway as I was going from the Temple to Grand Central Terminal. What is interesting here is the different font used on this sign (look at the 7). It was weird on the front, too! For the first time since rollsigns were on NYCT buses, a bus with more than one LOWER CASE letter (this does not include SMALL CAPS). The text on the front sign literally said, "via AMSTERDAM."
Interesting, isn't it?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=4151&item=2248928635&rd=1
It says it was manufactured by "FLX, INC."; I would assume that to be a separate company, but does anyone know for sure?
-F.
It's the Vengutzi of a previous generation!
-F.
(KSDK) -- Three adults and 22 students were injured in a crash involving an Atlantic Express school bus and a Metro bus. It happened just after 7:30 a.m. Friday, in front of the Old Courthouse in downtown St. Louis.
Police say the two buses somehow collided and hit a man who was walking his dog. The dog died.
The man is in critical condition at a local hospital. The school bus driver suffered minor injuries. The Metro bus driver is in serious condition at a local hospital.
26 children were on the school bus. They were going to Buerkle Middle School in the Mehlville School District. 22 students sustained minor injuries, the remaining four students were not injured.
Photos:
The buses are primarily ex-school buses, both local and long-distance buses, and primarily two-stroke buses at that, albeit there are some buses with Navistar V8 engines (T444E) on them. The primary reason that this is the case is because standard American buses would not hold up on streets here, especially outside the capital, and that includes the rugged RTS model. In addition, the express buses from Panama City to Colon use soft-seaters, but mostly European models such as Scania, Mercedes-Benz, would be Setra in the US, Hyundai buses, Daewoo buses, and a few MC-9s--no A3s as of yet!
The transportation center in Panama City is one to die for in the US! (Nothing like it in the US compares!)
More details over the next few days.
How interesting...
~Professional school bus "basher"
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
The only buses with two doors standard are the Hyundai buses. None of the buses have wheelchair lifts. There are some imported buses that had wheelchair lifts, but they were removed when they were reseated.
July is a nice time to be un-employed, well no time is, but if it's going to happen, July is better then January.
Is that a better answer?
David
David
David
I caught 7510 instead, on the B49. And that morning 7504 was behind the B49 I was on -- had I known, I would have waited for it.
BIG AL
Hope this helps.
I really wish they would. Going places would be so much easier for me.
SEPTA also has SportWorks, but their use is more intermittant, they're only used on certain routes designated as bike routes, such as the 37 and others. Even if you see a bike rack equipped bus on a non-bike route, don't count on being able to use the rack. I have seen Bikes on off-peak Subway Surface trolleys (carried internally, w00t for a 50 foot LRV!), as well as the MFL and BSS subways. Regional rail seems to be the only mode SEPTA has that is officially open to bikes on all off peak trains, the others are far greyer areas.
Many of the more progressive (read: newer, aren't bogged down with Unions and BS) TAs out west have bike racks on all their buses, and encourage riders to make use of them. I know KC Metro in Seattle, Trimet in Portland and VTA in San Jose all have racks and utilize them. I'm sure there's many other TAs around the country with bike racks and good utilization programs that I'm ignoring, but oh well.
I have to wonder why more TAs don't have bike racks. It seems to be a perfect way to expand your network without actually increasing service. If the passenger can travel that much further to the bus than he could with walking then he might be encouraged to take the bus to work rather than drive. Why doesn't NYC have racks on their buses? That whole excuse of "we don't want the insurance" is BS, other TAs have worked out the litigation, why the hell can't the MTA? There must be a precedent, and if worse comes to worse, you can always just make a "Take your bike to work" Metrocard showing all the advantages of biking to work via the bus, just stick "MTA not responsible for damage to bike" across the bottom, and train the drivers to stop short.
Finally, has anyone ever seen a bike rack from any manufacturer other than Sportworks? I have never seen anything other than their racks. It happens that they're based out of Woodinville, Washington, where I have some family, and I even had a cousin who worked for a summer in their plant. Do they have any competition? All I ever see is buses with tell tail little yellow tag on the left side of the mounting to the bumper.
A Sportworks rack on SEPTA D40LF 5712:
"Other places"(meaning not nyc I'm assuming) is that there's bike racks on the front of the bus usualy with 2-3 slots and you have to buy a card/parmit from the county office.
Good yes. Ugly yes, also.
Any bulky item must conform to the NYCRR Part 1050-9 of the NYC Authorities Law: http://216.156.84.253/1050-9-bulky.gif
Secondly, *no* bulky item may be brought onto *any* NYCT surface bus between the hours of 6:00AM - 10:00 AM and 4:00 PM - 7:00 PM, as per the MTA/NYCT Rules and Regulations.
The fact that a bicycle, be it folded in nature, matters not as it constitutes a "bulky item" and as such, must conform to the NYCRR and NYCT RR.
Therefore, NO bicycles, be they folded or otherwise, may be brought onto MTA buses if they ae in violation of the NYCRR.
They may NOT block aisles.
They may NOT interfere with other passengers.
They may NOT occupy a seat.
They may NOT block doorways/stairs.
They may NOT inconvenience passengers.
They may NOT be considered as "ambulatory apparatus" as defined by federal stature and the ADA.
Hope this helps.
It'll be a rare day to see NYCT enforce it's own rules...
Dayton, Ohio has a fleet of Skoda ETBs.
David
In canada Vancouver's Translink runs a massive ETB network, and ETS in Edmonton runs a very similar system. Toronto had ETBs until recently, when they were sadly bustituted.
It's important to remember that nearly every American city at one time or another had an ETB system in the period after NCL destroyed the trolleys and before standard oil addicted the US on oil. There is absolutely no reason why ETB systems couldn't be installed in any CBD today. Los Angeles looked into ETB for their system, even going so far as starting on EISes and major planning before idiocy killed the project. Sadly complete ignorance ruled that day, since NIMBYs popped out of the wood work and decried the ETB installation as creating too many harmful EMFs. Unfortunately nobody explained to them that a 600vdc overhead catenary makes fewer EMFs than their microwave when it's off! Today LAMTA is home to the biggest CNG fleet in the nation, literally burning money while they are fleeced by enron-like 'energy companies' who are little more than get rich quick middlemen. CNG is heading for one hell of a fall, as is the whole Natural Gas market. Our demand for natural gas has outstripped the domestic production of it, and now have to import, there no longer is really any advantage to CNG, it's just diesel with very poor gas mileage.
A CNG bus already cost more then diesel version, no matter how you look at it. Tranckless (elect.) or clean diesel are both better options.
David
( To view the full album, visit Fast
Ferry Arrival Photos )
Had no idea it was that large, though!!
I'm assuming this one boat that does seasonal trips from Mexico to Florida is about that size, since they both hold cars.
I'm going to assume, for assumptions sake, that the Queen Mary 2 is nicer. :)
This where cars/buses/bikes get inside:
I just got home and saw the most unbelievably cool thing, a Chinabus getting pulled over by the NJ State police for multiple traffic offenses. And how it got there was even cooler:
I first saw the bus up at the exit 6, the PA Turnpike connector, where I entered. I wound up with one in front of me, one behind, the front one was definitely Today Coach VanHool C2045 #002. I think the back one might have been TodayCoach as well, it was a VanHool C2045, but that doesn't narrow the field down much. Either way the rear one was driving like a maniac, swerving in and out of the two right lanes, tailgating everything that should dare to get in front of it. They weren't going particularly fast, only about 65 or so, so I sped up and got ready to get away from them.
That's when the Chinabus driver made his first mistake. He spotted an opening created by his comrade in front of him, on the right of a truck, and floored it for the hole in the considerable traffic. He was rolling along at probably 75 or so mph down the right side of a truck when a slow moving Lincoln Towncar foiled his plans to pass the truck (who was doing 70mph easy). With a sliver of space, possibly as small as 50 feet between the rear bumper of the Lincoln and the front bumper of the truck, the Chinabus driver flipped the bird to the trucker and cut him off, to the accompaniment of screeching brakes and a horn. During this exchange I had just passed the truck on the left and was preparing to occupy the space the Chinabus had just pulled into. I slowwed down, thinking a collision was imminent, fortunately the trucker at least knew how to handle his rig and he avoided the bumper of the VanHool. I managed to see the trucker talking in the CB radio through my rear view mirror, and quickly figured out something would soon be up.
Sure enough just north of exit 5 two trucks rather solidly blocked the way in the two right lanes, a flatbed and a box truck from some small local carrier, both moving at about 65 mph were right in the Chinabuses way. I realized this was the trucker's revenge, and decided I didn't want to miss this. At the time I was about 100 feet down the road from the Chinabus and placed myself right behind the flatbed in the left lane.
The Chinabus came right up onto my bumper, to call what he was doing tailgating is an understatement, there were times all I could see was the seemingly massive VanHool plate in my rear view mirror and a headlight in each side view mirror. What I was doing was completely irrational, and probably more than a little suicidal. If something had happened in front of the flatbed I probably would have been crushed like a bug, my little 1000 or so pound honda civic little match for two 50000lb monsters, at least one of who's brakes I did not care to put any faith in. I'm sure the two truckers might have wondered who the little white car who seemingly had blithely joined their ad hoc baracade was, but neither of them made any kind of motion acknowledging me. Other trucks would pass on the right, pulling to within a car length of the box truck before the box truck would accelerate and the original trucker would pull up beside the chinabus, trapping him in the box, it was actually an amazingly well orchestrated operation, I sat in the middle of it some 20 feet behind the flatbed, 5-10 feet in front of the chinabus in mild awe. Traffic streamed by on the left, most of the cars zipping by were probably completely unaware of what was happening. And through all this the Chinabus driver raged, flashing his high beams, honking occasionally, and swerving slightly to the left every so often.
We continued like this down to about 10 miles north of Exit 4, where the chinabus made his stupidest blunder. He'd been raging silently for almost 5 minutes, and then suddenly put on his left turn signal and began accelerating. As he pulled into the left lane he appeared to miss my left rear bumper by probably less than a foot.
Now in this exact same spot I got a speeding ticket only a month ago, 93 in a 65 zone, so I knew this speed trap well. It happens to be right where the NJ State Police have their barracks on the NJTP, and the cops sit up on the embankment adjacent to the overpass and time cars zipping down the turnpike. They are in an excellent position to see a long way down the road and then also to get up to speed coming down the ramp. Of course today there was a cop up there, and I think the chinabus driver saw him shortly before I did, he was about abreast of me when I suddenly was going faster than him. By the time I saw the cop, he was already rolling, lights on and headed for the ramp. The chinabus was down to 55 in the left lane, and he began drifting across to the shoulder. I lost sight of him as he pulled onto the shoulder. He should have a rather large ticket coming, a Commercial Vehicle in the left lane, doing probably around 80 in a 65 zone, I got a 200 dollar ticket just for doing 93 in a 65 zone, what with the left lane prohibition and the fact that it's a commercial vehicle, his will be considerably more.
Oh well, just some excitement on my commute home today...
In other chinabus related news, the City of Mt Laurel and NJT are fighting Chinabus pickups at or around their bus terminal, right off Rt73 at Exit 4. Also Philadelphia is having great success combatting Chinabus pickups at SEPTA stops, no longer is the 48 bus held captive by VanHools sitting in it's stops. It used to be that the Chinabus operators had english/chinese signs bound to the SEPTA bus stop signs, those have come down and now there are walking Transit Police, Philadelphia Parking Authority and Philadelphia PD officers walking around chinatown, looking for violaters. Also the City is supposed to be fighting the Russian buses that run from NE Philly to Brighton Beach, however they're harder to fight since they usually have a stop located on their own property. Land is cheaper in the Northeast than it is in Center City, and they run semi-legitimate terminals in small driveways and alleys in the NE.
Darn
Chinabus driver drives erratically all over the highway behind his equally erratic comrade. Cuts off truck driver gets boxed in by numerous other truck drivers. There you go.
The moral is, you never really know what could happen. Practicing defensive driving techniques will help you live longer. Playing tag with buses and trucks may seem like fun, but the consequences of the slightest mistake could mean the difference between never walking again, or worse.
Be careful, please.
Chuck Greene
The best place to really see extreme driving elements are the Robert Moses Highways in New York as well as the Cross Bronx Expressway, but new drivers aren't allowed there for a long time.
And why do you say that "new drivers aren't allowed there for a long time"? The minimum driving age is higher in NYC than in most of the rest of the country, but many new drivers are above NYC's minimum driving age, and they're welcome to drive the Cross Bronx the instant they're licensed.
As for my "new drivers aren't allowed there for a long time", I can back that statement up with the NYS DMV website:
You must be age 16 or over to drive in NYS. If you have a learner permit or a driver license from another state, you are not exempt from this rule. Drivers under the age of 18 must obey the restrictions described in the DMV brochures, New York State's Graduated Licensing Law and Learner Permits and Junior Licenses. An out-of-state driver under the age of 18 must also obey all restrictions of the state that issued the driver license.
GENERAL RESTRICTIONS FOR ALL DRIVERS WITH LEARNER PERMITS
No matter what age you are, if you hold a learner permit, you may not drive:
Unless accompanied by a person at least age 21 who has a valid license for operating the vehicle you are driving. For example, only a person with a motorcycle license may supervise a motorcycle learner.
In a DMV road test area.
On any street within a park in New York City, or any bridge or tunnel under the jurisdiction of the Triborough Bridge and Tunnel Authority.
On the Cross County, Hutchinson River, Saw Mill River, or Taconic State parkways in Westchester County.
JUNIOR LICENSE
Regional Restrictions
New York City (5 Boroughs) Long Island (Nassau & Suffolk) Upstate (All Other Counties)
5 AM - 9 PM 5 AM - 9 PM 5 AM - 9 PM
UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES When accompanied by a licensed parent, guardian, person "in loco parentis," driver education teacher, or driving school instructor.
Not accompanied, you may drive only directly between your home and work, a work-study program, a course at a college, university, or registered evening high school, a driver education course, or while engaged in farm employment.
WITHOUT BEING ACCOMPANIED
9 PM - 5 AM 9 PM - 5 AM 9 PM - 5 AM
UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES You may drive only directly between your home and a work-study program, a course at a college, university, or registered evening high school, a driver education course, or while engaged in farm employment. When accompanied by a licensed parent, guardian, or person "in loco parentis."
Not accompanied, you may drive only directly between your home and work or school.
Complete brochure here
Ive summonsed quite a few for that.Even Driving Schools have boldly attempted the feat .
Chuck Greene
But even on 295, or in most places for that matter, no one goes the speed limit (over 65 in a 45 MPH construction zone).
It's a couple of turns, but not bad at all. Going N/B take exit 56 from I-295. At the end of the exit ramp bear to right. Take this road to end (about 1/4 mile), turn left, proceed to light (about 1000 feet), turn left and NJ Turnpike is immediately on your right.
S/B take NJ Turpike exit 7. After toll plaza bear to left, right turn at light, take very next right turn, proceed about 1/4 and you'll see the I-295 signage.
I like this point to switch between the 2 highways because it's quick (only 1 light) and there food stops and fuel. The bonus is that the gas station doesn't have the NJ Turnpike high gas prices.
NB
Take 295 to exit 47A towards Mount Holly. Follow Burlington-Mount Holly Road to the Turnpike
SB
Take Exit 5. After the toll, turn left to go towards Burlington. Follow Burlington-Mount Holly Road to 295, the enterance ramp will be on the right.
Like at your point, there are food stops and fuel but there are a few more traffic lights. Even so, it does not take long to get from one road to the other. An advantage to your way is that from exit 7, the toll to travel to wherever it is you are going will be less.
14 Continue on New Jersey Tpke Cars Only Ln,I-95 at sign reading "Turnpike South to Cars Only" and go Southwest for 33 miles 33.33 53.64
15 Continue on New Jersey Tpke and go Southwest for 73 miles 72.59 116.82
16 Continue on I-295 and go West for 6 miles 5.57 8.96
17 Exit I-295 via ramp to I-95 and go West for 1.1 miles 1.15 1.85
18 Continue on I-95 and go Southwest for 93 miles 93.06 149.77
19 Exit I-95 via ramp at sign reading "Exit 27-25 I-495 W to College Park / Silver Spring and US-1" and go Southwest for 1.0 miles 1.01 1.63
20 Continue on Capital Beltway,I-495 Outerloop,I-495 and go Southwest for 29 miles 29.45 47.4
21 Exit Capital Beltway,I-495 Outerloop,I-495 via ramp at sign reading "Exit 57A I-95 S to Richmond" and go Southeast for 0.3 miles 0.29 0.47
22 Bear right on I-95 and go South for 85 miles 84.83 136.52
23 Exit I-95 via ramp at sign reading "Exit 84A I-295 S to Rocky Mt Nc" and go Southeast for 1.6 miles 1.62 2.61
24 Continue on I-295 and go South for 42 miles 41.71 67.13
25 Exit I-295 via ramp at sign reading "I-295 S to Emporia / Rocky Mount Nc and I-95 South" and go Southwest for 0.7 miles 0.66 1.06
26 Continue on I-95 and go Southwest for 341 miles 341.44 549.49
27
As for going around DC, I would NOT follow the directions you have there. Simply follow signs for 95/495 SOUTH to RICHMOND. Do not take the exit for College Park and Silver Spring. Shortly after crossing the Woodrow Wilson Bridge, take the exit for 95 South. It used to be on the right, now it is on the left.
The second 295 is somewhere in North Carolina and has nothing to do with what we are discussing in this thread.
And the beltway is the worst part, outside of miami.Rest of 95 is tolerable.
I don't drive the part of the Turnpike that the NYCT buses use but I can imagine what it is like.
Congrats Mr Lightning Rod! You're now the only target for a whole pisspot full of overzealous folks who will now exhibit their Azn pryde on your sorry ass.
As it happens I agree with you, however I'd say the ABCs are better than the FOBs. I fear seeing a cheap toyota sedan driving down the street in the left lane, left turn signal on with two or three people of asian decent with really bad haircuts.
Oh well, have fun being flamed, they're really worked up over it.
Wonder if his dad feels the same...
But anyway, EVERY race, class, and subgenre of people have some who got their licenses in a box of Cracker Jacks. If this were a thread about teenage drivers, I could just as easily say something "rude" about them, when it's obviously not true of them ALL. I'm one of them, after all. But lots of people would generally feel the same way.
If I saw a reckless cabbie, and made a comment about "those stupid cab drivers...", then the law-abiding cabbies would get on my case, despite my belief that every cabbie and livery driver in the whole damn city has a "I'm the king of the road" gene in their bodies.
Hmmm....maybe they're the rejects and drop outs from truck driving school.....
None..........
C'mon, lighten up, no need to go starting flame wars, even Subtalk and Rider Diaries are civilized enough for this to be little more than a damp match rather than a flame war.
Besides, Have you even got anything to say about the Chinabuses from the passenger's point of view? I can say I've rode Chinabus over 7 or 8 times, I've sat right behind the driver to observe his every move, I have never doubted my drivers on any of my trips. They may speed and drive particularly faster than everyone else on the road, but they do it safetly and smoothly. Much like an experienced driver rushing to get somewhere, but not like some new teenage driver going ballistic all over the road with his "souped up" car.
Besides, Not all Chinabus drivers are chinese. They do have black , hispanic, and I'd assume some white drivers.
Like I say, Try it for experience's sake before you say anything about it.
You may enjoy such rapid service, but it's illegal and highly dangerous to the rest of us. Of course, there are Greyhound drivers, truckers, and other people who just have to risk killing the rest of us to save 10 minutes on a 300 mile trip.
Ya gotta love truckers, b/c when it comes to revenge, they, as well as an entire convoy, will get that oh so sweet revenge, lol.
"The Box" has always been one of my favorite things to watch. The truckers do it so well, and it's so funny to see the person that was at first trying to be a hot shot being held at the the wim of those truckers. I must have seen this a hundred times. Only once I've seen it done carelessly, which I think did cause an accident.
You're really lucky though that you didn't get into an accident.
I can't wait to get a CB, hopefully within a few monthes. Are there any scanners that are also CB equiped?
Oh, and what's this russian company now? Never heard of this. Is it new? Where in Brighton Beach do they run from? What kinda buses they got? How much to phili?
This is the only part of the post I am responding to.
Another friends brother drives a mack dump truck
My uncle used to be a long haul driver as well.
Basically, I just wanna have a CB. I don't wanna start screwin wit truckers heads like in Joy Ride(even though I love that movie).
And yeah, I saw the same police chase video. That was really cool.
http://www.davemade.com
Where is this police barrack exactly? When I drive the Turnpike, I switch over to/from 295 at Exit 5 (Mount Holly) and am not very familiar with the Turnpike south of that interchange. I have only driven on it myself once though I have been a passenger there a number of times, I don't know it that well except for the fact it is an almost perfectly straight shot for about 50 miles.
If there hasn't well they must be doing something right and if so then maybe they aren't the safest coaches on the road.
And Oren don't be bragging about Amtrak, they have had alot of derailments, including a couple this year. In fact there have been jokes made about Amtrak by various comedians. The best way to get from here to there, is.........to have a genie, because everything else is screwed up.
Amtrak is not by any means perfect but I don't hear about these sorts of things happening on the rails or with other bus carries (i.e. Greyhound). The safest way to travel is not to travel at all. If you never go anywhere, you won't have to worry about being in a crash, derailment, etc.
What are you doing driving anyway, dont' liek the bus/train?
And on another note, what kinda sucky state bans lady's get in free deals to bars?
Least he used his turn signal.
Anyway, what are you doing with transit systems if you're capable of driving 93mph? I can't even get past 20mph on I-4, and I'm told I-4 is great and I don't need transit or a bullet train.
Is this still going to happen & will they close the Triboro, Green & Jamaica Bus garages down when the takeover takes effect July 1.
David
What do you guys think of a B110 like route in Philly? What streets will it run on? And how will SEPTA handle such service on its turf?
And you don't have to imagine, just get on the 58 bus. Used to be english speaking, now the only english speaking person is the driver, maybe we can push the commies off again. :)
How SEPTA will handle that service? They won't. The 58 has been overcrowded, sucky, and small forever. They need more freq. bigger buses. In tampa if they report ONE freaking person standing, they use a bigger bus. Not septa.
Chuck Greene
Left out the word "to"
Chuck Greene
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The buses get even more frequent if you can make a SHORT trip to bells corner too!
I only see one trip on the weekday schedule that starts from Bells Corner, but having more buses run from there is a good idea!
Chuck Greene
It was easier down that way. If you're going to Neshaminy from anywhere north of Old Bustleton, that was a pain.
That's one bus route that's never changed in forever.
Chuck Greene
Is the chimp prepared to do such heavy duty electrical engineering? He may strike due to unfair working conditions.
OR
The next bus will be the competing WMATA route that comes at said time.
That said, when used in the context of "DUH BUS," "Clever Devices" is an oxymoron...
As for the Clever devices, it will probably be some guy named George personally announcing the stops along with the "BONG" sound.
For out of state busfans visiting MON-FRI ride THE BUS for these reasons 1)You will get a good laugh, believe me when I am not ticked off to high heaven about getting the rolling crap when they are supposed to come, I quietly crack up, and 2)If you think your T/A sucks, wait till you ride DUH BUS, it will make any T/A look better.
Wes Samuels,
WMATA doesn't want me and THE BUS is afraid I'll take over :-D
It will be sad if they could get this running and yet can't program their own destination signs.
Now I'm having dreams of standing on Northern Blvd around the Douglaston area waiting for a bus to the 7 train at Main St, and the Q12 just isn't coming but the N20s and N21s are flying by, not letting me on.
1) Prevention of bus overcrowding
2) Limiting trip time
First one's out, and I'm sure if the second one applies, it can't be much.
I'll contact MTA when I get some free time.
2) I am concerned that you have a reading comprehension problem. In one of your latest posts, you state that you've scanned the board and could not find information on a topic. Yet, some of those topics have been under discussion for the last two weeks. I suggest that you use the search function on top of the page to see if any of your questions have been answered. For example, if you want to find info about schedules, click on "Search Archives" and punch in "schedules" into the search box.
3) Your posts are painful to read. Your sentences are not clear and it hurts my brain to figure out what you are trying to stay.
4) Brooklyn67 probably has you on killfile. Before you ask, "killfile" is a way to get rid of posts from posters you don't like for whatever reason.
5) Whether as NYCT TRANSIT EXPERT or CDTA, you DO ask the same questions over and over again. Imagine if your mom said for you to do your homework ALL THE TIME even if your homework was done. It would make you mad. It makes us very mad when you keep asking questions about the same thing over and over again. If you keep doing that, we will get even meaner and meaner until we make you cry. If you don't want us to be mean, stop making us upset.
Some of you still don't get me;
To those that have already realized that I'am not CDTA, thank you.
Steve
BIG AL
DA HUI
"Counseling" is an interview- a non-disciplinary (first non-offense, I might add which indicates this particular operator hasn't had any discipline in at least 3 years) form of showing the claim was investigated. It's lower on the totem pole than a slap on the wrist.
This "counsel" will be stricken and erased from this operator's permanent record within 36 months as if it had never been there.
I hope it was well worth the time and energy you put into it. I'm sure everyone involved had a hearty laugh about it and went about their business of the day.
Michael
Which M4 do you affiliate yourself with? Madison Avenue or Nebraska Avenue?
Michael
Washington, DC
Only the private line employees NOT covered by a union agreement are in danger of losing their jobs.
Michael
Washington, DC
But what about...
Though I don't...
I'm guessing...
Try hypo-allergenic lipstick.
I guess those are the only conditions you'll let somebody kiss your a**.
Apparently, you're looking for conditions to "kiss my a**". Sorry, I'll pass. I prefer genetic females. Try the personals section. They say there's someone for everyone. Quite possibly, even you.
I know everything
You know NOTHING!!
Gee, that's odd. I don't recall ever posting any of the above quotations. Please refresh my memory by posting the link to them, to prove your once-again outlandish fabrications and accusations.
In contrast, however, my posted excerpts are snippets of your actual messages.
Here it is:
Re: What Does it Mean When We're "Counseled"?
Posted by M4 on Mon Jun 7 19:40:29 2004, in response to Re: What Does it Mean When We're "Counseled"?, posted by ar on Mon Jun 7 16:48:10 2004.
Only the private line employees NOT covered by a union agreement are in danger of losing their jobs.
Michael
Washington, DC
Your presence here, along with the rantings, tantrums and ignorant misinformation you spew is comic relief enough. But if it weren't, as if we needed more, you chasing buses from Port Authority to Greenwich Village in spiked heels and spandex tights is more than enough to ensure that comic relief :-)
(Ducks from swinging purse)
BIG AL
BIG AL
I'll be sure to give you the date. Just don't take a different assignment where I can't find you.
I may even come out to Stillwell and 86th and see how you do your job.
Since you know absolutely nothing about the job, functions or duties of a NYCT SLD, why would you want to observe someone who obviously doesn't value your presence? It would be quite understandable for you to observe someone else who could explain the details to you while you observed, so you'd better understand what was going on.
A post such as this could easily be misconstrued for another meaning. Be more careful...
Do you speak another language other than English?
because you need to learn how to ,talk and type(or write)
in English.
Robert
Out here in Northern California where I live, most TA's require youto be at least 21 years old, have at least a few years of clean driving record and experience, and so forth
Here are the Orion VII i saw(these are all assigned to WF):
#7670,#7681,7720,#7721,#7726,#7740.
M1-#6386-Orion VII Hybrid
BX19-#1106-New Flyer Articulated.
BX21-#7727-Orion VII.
BX6-#8799-NOVABUS.(note: #8794-#8795 plus #8800's have come to Ulmer Park-this one could be next).
Wonder how thats going to work. This means GH or WF would have alot of units in their depot. It would make sense for GH to get 213-226, 233-255 to go with 173-212. But thats almost pointing GH back to 300+ buses, which means parking buses on the outside street again. Wonder if that going to happen. I wounder why WF would get the 200s if they do get them. I know WF can hold more buses but its interesting because their O7 order is coming in thats 160 buses + 63 Orion V 400s, and 85 rts. Unless that WF RTS are on the move out to Brooklyn! I personally think WF is getting a part of the O7 HEV order and getting some of the new artics. Just my thought.
Gun Hill has already gotten all they need in the Orion department......So the MCH Orions are heading elsewhere, my guess is Queens.
Trevor
Ray
Da Hui
Danny
Da Hui
It has been awhile for me to post. Very busy - work, personal issues. I had to change my original handle (flx7595) because the site required new passwords..shows how long I have been gone.
But I read, and am grateful to the insights of many of you on the goings on in NYC (In particular Brooklyn67, Q5 Merrick and Big Al). I am not a bus employee, just a person who has watched them since I can remember. And when I see something, or have a question, I will post it or ask it. I apologize in advance if the question has been asked before, but I try to read the postings at least twice a week.
Now that I have blabbed enough, I see something I want to report.
Today, Bus #9354 is in service on the Q15 line. QV stickers, no ads, looks freshly painted.
A rare thing to see on my streets since all I have seen for years are the Orions. Two people at the bus stop thought it was a "new bus the city must have just bought".
Till next time.
JP
The part in parenthesis was sarcastically written, mind you. This potential photo ban annoys me.
Thanks.
JP
Those poor people in Bayside musta thought it was a Q31 heading their way!
jp
until next time
jp
There's a lot of people around here who are fans of the bus for such a car-centric state. Also, it looks liek the AVL machines int eh buses are working now.
Plus, I'm so happy, I got four low floor gilligs today, ice cold air, smooth quiet rides. Nice.
And don't ever let anyone tell you drivings cheaper, if i have to do another 500 dollar brake job or other peice of work in the next two years, I give up.
Dave
Da Hui
BIG AL
Flatbush got 4684,8142,8170,8176,8345
ENY got 8897
BIG AL
And does all the other buses from green run out of the depot on Rockaway Blvd?
Or is it just another storage facility for green buses
Like NYCT's Staten Island Division, Green's Jamaica and Rockaway facilities function as a single garage with two yards.
Today I took a ride on the M60 with Orion VII HEV#6384, I must say these buses are pretty gutsy. We walked the hill without any slow down and was passing cars like it was standing still.
The Orion VII HEV definately gets my two thumbs up!
And for you sound fans of TransiTALK, the next update will feature a recording of today's ride and SPECIAL recording that I will leave unnamed!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Start on 42nd Street catch a M104 ride up to 125th Sreet to see all the different types of buses that they have so take some pics. Hangout there. Walk over to 3rd Ave catch a Manhattan Bound Lex Ave bus to 63rd, Catxh a F to about 179th or queens plaza. Where evers best to see private companys. Then cath a G go to Hoyt Stret go back to brooklyn cause i liked it there the last time i went for the first time. Hang out there for a while then catch an A to Euclid get on a B13 to go to command bus storage garage. Then get back on b13 go catch a J/Z to Manhattan at cypress hills. Hang out in lower manhattan and work my way up to 42nd by 6pm. Any suggestions also i get there at 10am.
But I would not suggest Queens Plaza to see a lot a privates
take the E to the last stop in Queens(Jamaica Center)
When you get out on Parsons and Archer you will see plenty on MTA
buses and some buses from Green and Jamaica. And you will also see
the N4 from MTA Long Island.
Now if you walk up Parsons Blvd to Jamaica Avenue
You can see buses from Queens Surface(Q25,34,65), from Jamaica(Q110,Q111,Q112,Q113),from Green(Q6,Q7,Q8,Q9,Q41) and also a host of MTA buses.
Thats my suggestion
Chuck Greene
BIG AL
At any rate, as the bus was pulling out from the stop she raised her knees (?) and I could see her legs were now bare, that the jeans were off. (Why was she raising her knees? Hmmm, maybe the explanation isn't so innocent after all!)
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
1. Has all the Green Lines (5500s) & Command Orion Vs have retrofitted Orange Signs? (Command 4961 has one)
2. For the RTSs, where does the 6v92 buses stop and the DD50s Begin?
(ex. 8161; 6V92, 8317; DD50)
3. Exactly how old are the Green Line RTSs (With roll signs)and the modern ones, were they bought second hand or original?
The 1990, 1993 RTS and 1993 Orion V were repowered in no particular order. There are still plenty of '90 RTS that still have their DD 6V-92TA engine. However originally it was like this
1993 RTS and 1993 Orion V originally had the DD 6V-92TA. All later NYCTA RTS came with the DD S50 except ('96 buses 9140-9149 which have the Cummins M11).
All DOT private RTSs were purchased new. Some buses have transferred between the companies.
NYCTA has always moved buses around quite frequently, but since the New Flyers Artics and CNG buses started coming in... that really had them moving buses all over and seemingly continuously.
I was pretty certain I said that, but I'll add 8565-6 came with the DD S50 and 8567 is a CNG bus that has been sent to Command.
As many as are needed. That's all any of us needs to know.
"Most Ironic Name on the Board"
Besides the brighter LED signs, anything that differs from the past order of Orion CNG's ?
Bill "Newkirk"
The LED signs on the former order are quite dim for daylight. I guess they looked at the other bus companies that have the brighter LED signs and saw the light !
Bill "Newkirk"
Don't know, probably will use same color LED with same brightness so they match.
Bill "Newkirk"
These are the buses that I saw tonight operating on the shuttle:
West Farms: 7710,1090,8801
Kingsbridge: 5473,5497,5702-(this bus has busted headlight already)
MCH: 6042
126 St: 5599,5619
Quill: 8633,9013,9025,9045
100 St: 1019,5556
Manhattanville: 5204,5130,8753,9516
Surprisingly I did not see a bus from Gun Hill operate on the shuttle.
We apologise for the unavoidable delay...
We have a Bx41 in front of us which was moving fairly slow so then we pass it and its a good ride heading south on WP Road and then we thought about getting on the Bx21 but decide to take the 5 then part ways so I head down to Union Square to take the Q then finish my trip.
The buses I saw:
KB: 5471,5497,5688,5689,5693,5702
WF: 1089,1090,1107,7678,7710,8055,8801
MV: 5190,5198,5204,8753,9516,9523
MCH: 6001,6042,6067
100: 1009,1019,5552,5556
MJQ: 8633,8991,8998,9013,9025,9045,9194
126: 5599,5619,5633
R68A 5154 (Q)
R142 1206 (4)
R142 1224 (4)
R143 8263 (L)
R32 3628 (A)
R62A 1920 Times Sq Shuttle
R142 7078 (4)
R68 2749 (D)
R32 3362 (F)
R62A 2332 (1)
R142 6595 (2)
NF Artic 1107 2 SHUTTLE
O7 7710 2 SHUTTLE
R142 6756 (5)
R68 2855 (Q)
After taking a trip from Stillwell with some people, I ride the F train from Neptune Av to 59 St/CC then catch the 1 train to 72 St and ride it up north to E 180 St to get the 2 shuttle bus, which must of been a emergency GO since it wasn't on the website. Anyway me and Carl head up north and first ride 1107 northbound and around Burke or Gun Hill Rd, WP Road is narrowed to one lane in each direction [including the 'service' road' so this car which had a bad mash up in the front took about 10 minutes to clear up so we catch up to the two buses in front of us, 5688 and 6067. A cool ride the rest of the way and we grab some food at Mickey D's and we wait for ZF O7 7710 to return so then after about 15 minutes we see it arrive and its nice and cold in the bus so we depart.
We have a Bx41 in front of us which was moving fairly slow so then we pass it and its a good ride heading south on WP Road and then we thought about getting on the Bx21 but decide to take the 5 then part ways so I head down to Union Square to take the Q then finish my trip.
The buses I saw:
KB: 5471,5497,5688,5689,5693,5702
WF: 1089,1090,1107,7678,7710,8055,8801
MV: 5190,5198,5204,8753,9516,9523
MCH: 6001,6042,6067
100: 1009,1019,5552,5556
MJQ: 8633,8991,8998,9013,9025,9045,9194
126: 5599,5619,5633
R68A 5154 (Q)
R142 1206 (4)
R142 1224 (4)
R143 8263 (L)
R32 3628 (A)
R62A 1920 Times Sq Shuttle
R142 7078 (4)
R68 2749 (D)
R32 3362 (F)
R62A 2332 (1)
R142 6595 (2)
NF Artic 1107 2 SHUTTLE
O7 7710 2 SHUTTLE
R142 6756 (5)
R68 2855 (Q)
I don't have the face sheet with a route description as of yet, or the details of exactly when it will begin, but I do have the HASTOS PADPRINT dated 06/04/2004 with run numbers, schedules and "x-pieces".
This shuttle will be servicing the Floral Park, Queens Village, Hempstead, Bellerose, Jamaica, Garden City and Stewart Manor LIRR Stations. There are 10 runs and 9 extra's.
More as details become available.
Also, I've ridden a route similar to what yourode via Greyhound(exit 40-exit 55 non stop).
Pretty nice scenary, never really noticed it before.
I presume that this is one of Jet-Away transportation vehicles used for shuttle service in the parking lots. Anyone else see this?
When the replay of the race was shown lower cameras were used and you didn't see over the top of any fence.
Trevor
More than likely 8567 will make a return, 8398 and 99 have been problematic, so I doubt they'll return with the takeover. 8398-99 barely see service as it is.
Trevor
4976 has been repowered with a DD Series 50 engine. I havent seen 4977 lately.
Robert
P.S. The reason I can't remenber the exect PSI now is that it's been almost 4 years since I work at as a B/O at JG. But you guys shoud still get what I am saying.
I am not 100% sure
Thank You
David
I Stand Corrected
Thanks Again
Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority, or Metro for short.
These buses had one blue and one green stripe. I thought LACMTA buses had yellow and orange stripes.
Bill "Newkirk"
The orange with white stripes is the new paint schemes for the "Metro Local" service (regular bus service). Or maybe they're for the Orange Line?
Blue buses...? Probably Santa Monica's "Big Blue Bus" (Santa Monica Municipal Bus Lines).
Vote at: TransitGallery.com TODAY!!!
B1-#9338-NOVABUS
S79-#4893-TMC(missing 85% of the bell stop tape)
B77-#589-Orion V CNG
B75-#822-New Flyer
B68-#840-New Flyer
Also the Orion 1 buses replaced all the ex Jamaica lines Grummans about two years ago.
There are at least two MC-9s still running, 110 and 3515. Thanks for the info on the As; any idea where the Ds came from?
B1-#4785-TMC
B64-#4779-TMC
You mean this one? :)
230 K6002098 1989 01.508 Pace 8849
Chuck
Here is the only list you'll ever need........
1985 GMC RTS-04 Transit: #3900-4218. "Not Many Left, If Any At All"
1986 GMC RTS-06 Transit: #4300-4599.
1996 GMC RTS-04 MTA In-House Transit Rebuilds: #7000-7037.
1997 GMC RTS-04 Midwest Bus Transit Rebuilds: #7500-7559.
1998 GMC RTS-04 MTA In-House Suburban Rebuilds: #7038-#7049
1997 MCI 102-DLW3SS: #1861.
1998 MCI 102-DLW3SS: #1860, #1862-2039.
1999 MCI 102-DLW3SS: #2040-2139.
2000 MCI D4500: #2705-2804.
2001 MCI D4500: #2140-2209 & #2805-2824.
2002 MCI D4500: #2825-2924.
1996 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #1000-1001
1997 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #1002-1069
1998 New Flyer C40LF CNG Low Floor: #801
1998 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #1070-1109
1999 New Flyer C40LF CNG Low Floor: #800, #802-856
1999 New Flyer D45S Viking Cruiser: #996-998
1999 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #1110 (nee #5250)
2000 New Flyer C40LF CNG Low Floor: #857-989
2000 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #1111 (nee #5251), #5253-5509
2001 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #5252
2003-04 New Flyer D60HF Galaxy Articulated: #5510-5769
1995 NovaBUS RTS-06 Transit: #8751-8752 (nee #8750-8751)
1996 NovaBUS RTS-06 Transit: #8752-9249
1996 NovaBUS RTS-06 Suburban: #9250-9349
1997 NovaBUS RTS-06 Transit Hybrid Electric: #9900 "Retired"
1997-98 NovaBUS RTS-06 Transit: #4901, #9350-9699
1998 NovaBUS LFS: #999 (nee #995) "Retired"
1999 NovaBUS RTS-06 Transit: #4900, #4902-5249
2000-01 NovaBUS RTS-06 Transit Hybrid Electric: #6360 "Retired"
2002 NovaBUS LFS: #956-957 (Operated by MTA Bridges & Tunnels)
1993 BIA Orion V Suburban: #93001-93072 (#101-172).
1993 BIA Orion V Transit: #93073-93096 (#173-196), 197-316.
1994 OBI Orion V CNG Transit: #317.
1994 OBI Orion V Transit: #400-401.
1995 OBI Orion V Transit: #402-580.
1995 OBI Orion V CNG Transit: #581-610.
1995 OBI Orion V Suburban: #611-630.
1996 OBI Orion V Transit: #631-680.
1998 OBI Orion V Transit: #6000.
1998 OBI Orion VI Hybrid Electric: #6350-6353 (Ex-NJ Transit).
1999 OBI Orion V Transit: #6001-6349.
1999 OBI Orion VI Hybrid Electric: #6354.
2000 OBI Orion VI Hybrid Electric: #6355-6359.
2002 OBI Orion VII CNG: #7560.
2002 OBI Orion VII HEV: #6365.
2003-04 OBI Orion VII CNG: #7561-7814. "In Delivery"
2003-04 OBI Orion VII HEV: #6366-6689. "In Delivery"
1987-88 TMC RTS-06 Transit: #4600-4872, #4889-4899.
1988 TMC RTS-06 Suburban: #4873-4888.
1990-91 TMC RTS-06 Transit: #8000-8396, 8400. "8400 is NYPD #9598"
1991 TMC RTS-06 Transit Hybrid: #8397 (Ex-CH3OH). "Retired"
1991 TMC RTS-06 Transit CNG: #8398-8399-CNG. "Transferred to Command Bus"
1993 TMC RTS-06 Transit: #8400-8564.
1994 TMC RTS-06 Transit CNG: #8567. "Transferred to Command Bus"
1994 TMC RTS-06 Transit: #8565-8566, #8600-8703.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Click Here For NYC Bus Photos
That's a pritty hard question to answer without a lot of research in advance and I work for a bus company [GRIN]
Or am I wrong? >=]
They smoke like heck and alot of things don't work. The kneeler got stuck on one the other day. The foreman are avoiding sending them out if they can. Various things have a tendency to rust, and stick after sitting for a few years. Oh well, another day in the life of the private lines!!
Or are you talking about that little CNG experiment that the MTA and the city are still having a good laugh over!!!! Ever wonder why you have never seen an MTA RTS6 L-10 CNG??? Private Lines= Guniea Pigs.
The companies are just the fall guys, for DOT's utter mismanagent. DOT regulates everything from how many buses on the lines, how many runs per pick, contract negotiations, and even how many mechanics per bus!!
By blaming the companies, it diverts attention from the real culprit! And that's why things haven't gotten fixed!!
And the one thing that people who love to knock the private companies don't realize; tremendous amounts of time and resources are consumed by CNG buses(because of cng, Queens surface's operating costs, per bus are higher than even the MTA!!)A perfect example is the radiatiors on Orions V vs. RTS. It'll take about 8 hours to replace an RTS radiator. On an Orion, it'll take 16!! Twice as long. Multiply that by the fleet, and realize that DOT has NOT increased the amount of mechanics, and anybody could see trouble coming! The Orion V CNG is a very hard bus to work on, and the example I just gave is typical.
CNG buses(RTS and Orion V) form 40% of the fleet! Another 45% is the 85'-86' RTS you refered to and the remainder is a patchwork quilt of repowered RTS Methanols(The MTA had one methanol buse once, ONE! Triboro had as many as 18! Private lines=Guinea pigs!), MTA RTS hand-me-downs, and MCI classics.
The perfect example is the L-10 RTS CNG's. In this heat, are notorious overheaters! And it's not because the radiators are clogged, it's a design defect!! It got so bad, that a former Guiliani admistration member, who lived in Rockaway(Q53), got so fed up with breaking down on the way to work, that she placed a call to who knows who, and bam! No more RTS CNG's on Rockaway! Now it's Orion CNG's!! I've also noticed people slamming LIB for breakdowns. Hmmmmm, what could it be, could it be SATAN!! No, of course not, it's just CNGs!! :)
There is a reason that the MTA has resisted the CNG bus. They have learned a lesson from who.........the private lines! They aren't stupid, and let us take the hammering. There was a time when Triboro was number 1 in bus fleets(I believe by NYSDOT), but that was before CNG buses, and when buses were replaced before their useful life had expired!
Um, New York City Transit has hundreds of CNG buses in service.
JD
The private lines runs about the same amount of CNGs, and have one third the overall buses.
Da Hui
I'd love to get one of those for the Q15...preferably one that does not say Main Sts Station (an error on the Q15 display sign).
jp
I think it's kinda funny.
11, 27 is now running every 30 minutes all day(think it ran every 15mins)
The 12, 15, 16, 25 and 26 runs every hour all day. I know the 26 runs every 30 minuts all day.
The 13 and 22 runs every 40 minutes all day. I know the 22(which BTW runs in front of my house) runs every 20 minutes during peak.
The 18 runs every 70 minuts all day
The 20 runs every 30 minutes peak and 40 minutes off peak.
The 17, 23 and 24 runs every 45 minutes all day.
Now on their website they said that this service delay will last about 30 to 45 days, and I think that it is either around that time or past that time. See what happens when you buy junk. Hey Chris G, didn't you tell me DUH BUS has had these problems over a month and a half ago.
~GM of The Alternative - no cutaways/ODVs allowed.
Are Opuses solid?
For those of you into Richmond buses and Flxibles, I thought you would appreciate this one. Originally painted in the old orange and tan colors, GRTC painted them in white with the purple stripe right before they were retired around 2000. These were the next-to-last New Look 53102s ever produced; the last order went to Milwaukee, and Richmond's order was built right after NYCTA's 9xxx series.
-F.
BTW, why do you want to know ?
Same bus @ 125th Street & St. Nicholas
Trevor
All we have in Pittsburgh are these Neoplan AN440LFs and those shoebox Gillig low-floors...we got high and low-floors. The only Orions I rode here are the Orion Vs.
We have buses with orange signs, the Gilligs.
Green's O5's have them, too (retrofits).
What I'd like to see is one of those 2000-series Triboro buses (former MTA buses) with working signage.
Anything beyond that is speculation
Thank You
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
CG
N71-#151-Orion V CNG
N72-#271-Orion V CNG
Thurston, did you personally manage this project or what? If so, I won't be surprised if the 65 I ride tomorrow is carpeted blue as well.
-Eliminate lots of express bus service.
C'mon, it's natural. Express bus service DOES cost more to operate. You balance your budget by eliminating a "specialized" fleet that has highly peaked ridership. They will kill routes and the first order of business is to kill some weak ones to sharpen their skills. Certain express routes shouldn't exist. However, express buses shouldn't be confined to Staten Island-Manhattan corridors either. Yes, they HAVE proposed this stuff before.
-Fare deals make people squeal
The fare can't be moved up easily in a political environment. So, you'll have to cut to keep things balanced.
-Give me all the cookies
Do you know that the Regional Bus concept will eventually funnel all monies to one downstate operator? No more giving Westchester its cut, Nassau its cut, Suffolk its cut, and Rockland its cut. We'll see money go out, but it will be very hard to play follow the money .
While the MTA takeover isn't bad in all respects, it is June 9 and not a single union has been spoken too. This means that they are not coming to the table at all. They want to obtain the club known as Regional Bus to dictate, not negotiate. This may force RBA to be passed, because which political tough-talking figure wants to be the guy to make the commuters walk the plank?
I started out at with Metro-E 4039 on the J2. The A/C was lacking a bit, but other than that - the ride along the hilly and curvy East-West Hwy was awesome. It was a fast bus and the B/O kept us going at a pretty good speed.
Arrived at Bethesda saw the regular stuff while waiting for Chris and Ray to arrive. They arrived a few minutes later on Orion V 5565 on the 47. We then board Metro-D 5700 on the 70. As usual the ride up I-270 was nice and the bus being in such great condition.
After refreshing ourselves with soft drinks we boarded Orion V 5567 for the ride back to Bethesda. This bus (35-footer CNG Orion V) can and did haul *ss. I'm quite accustomed to fast Ride-On buses, because they're just that and the B/Os really run them. I didn't see the speedo, but I'm certain we reached at least 70 MPH. We maintained our speed most of the way as we were going against the flow of rush hour traffic.
At Bethesda the fellas headed home - they left on Orion V 5603 on the 34. I was waiting for a 42, but Metro-B 9374 showed up on the J4. I decided not to pass up this up. This wasn't a veryu good ride as there was a lot of traffic on E-W Hwy going back toward Silver Spring.
At Silver Spring I got Orion VI 2039 on the F4. We caught up with Orion V 9644 on the F6 so I boarded it. At West Hyattsville I caught NF C40LF 2434 on the R4. At Brookland Station I got C40LF 2358 on the 80. Love the New Flyers! I arrive at Fort Totten and just my luck... John Deere 2463 (the next G8) arrived just before my E2 which was Metro-B 9301. At Georgia Ave I got NABI 5208 on the 70 for the ride home.
All in all, a very nice evening. While it was fun, it was a different type of fun than riding 70s up and down 270. Hopefully the power is on tomorrow or else Chris and I will have alot of time to go riding buses...
Wow, a John Deere - I'd love to try out one of them - and I am not too far away from the R2 either!
I hear so many 35fter CNG stories - I can't wait to ride one myself.
I'm surprised that the a/c didn't practically kill the power of the Metro E. The New Flyer I rode yesterday was much louder than usual (didn't sound like itself) and a lot more sluggish too. Probably belching smoke in the air like nothing else too (our New Flyers love to pollute the air - they are worse than the Neoplans!
That is Detroit Diesel for you.
I saw a 2001 Orion V spewing smoke when leaving friendship heights, but let me challenge you with my New Flyers.
those buses spew smoke out with leaving, but how many do it while sitting around idling? My New Flyers do that - well, maybe not spewing it, but a good amount does seep out of that exhaust pipe.
heck, I'd go to Cummins if their engines weren't so loud...nobody seems to like a roaring engine anymore...
-Fred
What's up wit' dat?
But I sure will be on the lookout for it. I assume the best time to see this is at night. My luck, I will run into it in the daytime on my way to work.
jp
Da Hui
BTW - does anyone know if all the Stengel Orions will have their rear tail lights converted to LED? Some haven't yet - mostly the Orion 1xx. Do they do it when the regular lamp blows out?
A short, very incomplete list follows (I only put down what I knew for sure): If I am wrong, please correct me:
101 - Yes
102- no (but needs it!)
103- yes
104-105 - no
106, 107 - do not know
108 - yes
109-110 - no
111-112 - yes
113-116 - do not know
117 - no
118-119 - do not know
227-229 - partially; 228 totally
230-232 - yes
256-299 - yes
300 - no
301-302 - yes
303-304 - no
305-308 - yes
309,312,314, 316 - do not know
310 - partially
311 - partially - upper left signal
313- no
315 - no
536-542,544-580,626-680 - yes; 556 only the bottom red lights. For a while, it was the only 5xx without the light conversion.
Til next time.
jp
Didn't get a photo, but I saw it one night...
SAS
So today, I'm posting a few assorted images of assorted bus stuff, and nothing that is too bad, on the part of GH
First, some light GH bashing- partially busted window on this mornings's bus
Pole on the turntable that is fully dislodged on the bottom
Now, non offensive assorted shots
Packed buses are fun
GO WEST FARMS!!!!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Do some depots get less funding than others? I'm trying to make sense of why GH is simply so horrible.
"Ring or ride" ( a retarded and cryptic little slogan) is on almost every GH bus. Ugh...
If you have a crew and set of operators that just dont give a shit, then it'll reflect in the buses also.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
Also:
PMSL @ your sig, very nice
This Saturday at Gaithersburg Garage will be the rodeo. Competition starts at 9:15 AM and lunch will be served starting at around 11:30. No idea if any other authorities will be there.
I think the DC group will have good attendance at this one. I should be there...
PS: Judges 8am :-)
Chuck Greene
I hope you guys have fun though - I'll contact you about the SEPTA Roadeo though.
Metro to provide shuttle buses Wednesday and Thursday nights to allow mourners to pay respects to former President Reagan
Metrobus, MetroAccess service also impacted by funeral
Metro officials will provide free shuttle buses from RFK Stadium to the U.S. Capitol late on Wednesday and Thursday nights (June 9 and 10) to enable mourners to pay respects to former President Ronald Reagan as his casket lies in state in the U.S Capitol Rotunda. The free shuttle buses will operate from 11:30 p.m. on Wednesday to 6 a.m. on Thursday and then again from 11:30 p.m. on Thursday to 6 a.m. on Friday. The shuttle bus service will complement the Metrorail system, which will be open as usual from 5:30 a.m. to midnight during the week.
Three 60-seat Metrobuses will be used to shuttle mourners every 15 minutes between the stadium and the Capitol to ensure the public is able to access the U.S. Capitol building--where the body of the nation's 40th President will lie in state in the U.S. Capitol Rotunda from 8:30 p.m. on Wednesday, June 9, through 7 a.m. Friday, June 11. More buses will be put on the road if the demand warrants the additional service.
Parking at RFK Stadium also will be free and will be monitored by the Metropolitan Police Department to ensure safety. An exact location for pick-up and drop-off has not yet been determined.
The additional service is expected to cost Metro approximately $2,000 to $3,000. Officials do not know how many mourners will take advantage of the special late-night shuttle service.
To honor the former President, Metro officials also draped black bunting today along a portion of the mezzanine at Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport Metrorail Station in Arlington. The station, which serves both the Blue and Yellow Lines, was renamed Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport Metrorail station in 2002
The week's events will also impact Metrobus and MetroAccess. Metrobuses will detour around several major road closures, and MetroAccess customers with a subscription to take a regular Friday trip will have to call to schedule them, due to the federal holiday as Ronald Reagan's body will lie in state and then the nation observes a federal holiday for the official state funeral of the nation's 40th President. The body of the former President is scheduled to arrive in downtown Washington, DC, across from The White House on Wednesday, June 9. A formal funeral procession to the U.S. Capitol will take place once the casket is transferred onto a horse-drawn caisson at 1600 Constitution Avenue. The caisson will proceed along Constitution Avenue at 6 p.m. to the U.S. Capitol for the state funeral ceremony. Constitution Avenue will be closed to traffic during that time.
In addition to Constitution Avenue being closed from 16th Street to the Capitol, several other nearby feeder roads will also be closed, requiring approximately 20 Metrobus routes to be detoured around the area of the road closures.
On Friday, June 11, the casket will be moved from the U.S. Capitol at 10:30 a.m. to Washington National Cathedral for the 11:30 a.m. national funeral service. Any road closures associated with the moving of the casket to the Cathedral may result in brief delays for Metrobuses. Metrorail service will not be impacted and will operate on its normal schedule.
Because Friday is considered a national holiday for the observance of the death of the former President, MetroAccess service automatically cancels all regular subscription trips for that day, instead customers are required to call MetroAccess at 301-562-5360 if they wish to schedule a trip for Friday.
For more information on how this week's memorial events will impact Metrobus and MetroAccess, visit www.metrooopensdoors.com.
Now I have 2 tasks for you bustalkers.1:Give the location of each pic.2:Identify the weird green bus.Extra kudo's if anyone can do that.
BTW,for those who can access Imagestation,don't be going to my album to find the answers,it wouldn't be fun that way.
Da Hui
Da Hui
The SunJet MCI-9 is probably parked on E.98th in Brooklyn in front of Jet-Away Transportation's yard, near the end of the "L" line.
The NYBS MCI-Classic is northbound on Madison Ave on 24th or 25th Street.
Trevor
It's the M7...the location is Broadway at approximately 62nd Street. I should know that, I passed through that was many a time when I was going to high school.
:)
Photo #2: Looks like somewhere near Flushing, Queens. Can't pinpoint the location.
Photo #3: I believe that's somewhere near Fort Schuyler or Locust Point in Throgs Neck.
Photo #4: The weird green bus appears to be a Neoplan (i think the model is a Centroliner or a Skyliner, but I forgot)...
Photo #5: In front of the Buhre Avenue (6) station.
Photo #6: Somewhere in Brooklyn, can't pinpoint where...
Photo #7: Broadway at 62nd St on the Upper West Side.
Photo #8: 57th and Lex, Midtown.
Photo #9: 24th and Madison, Midtown South. You shot it viewing south from 25th St.
Photo #10: In front of the White Plains Metro-North station. That's a Harlem Line M3 in the station behind the bus.
SAS
-Fred
Da Hui
-Fred
5471-5500
5596-5600
5601H-5612H
5613-5656
5793-5808 (tentative)
5831H-5850H (due later this summer)
I saw 5811 on the 38 today.
I guess that means Red Arrow will be getting their 5700s soon; I had heard reports that at least two buses went out of service due to fires, but have yet to confirm which ones.
Holly Maynard (06/09/04) -- Most of Rochester-area drivers are paying $2.15 for regular gas right now, a month ago it was $1.94, a year ago it was $1.49. Instead of paying those higher prices, many commuters are turning to the Rochester-Genesee Regional Transportation Authority's Park-and-Ride System.
For 16 years, Torry Hirsch has parked her car in a convenient lot and ridden an RTS bus to work. She says she's noticed a lot more people taking advantage of the bus service recently.
Amy Forrett is one of them. She said she's just sick of paying high gas and parking prices.
"I put maybe $10 a week in my car because I live about a mile from the drop off, so I'm saving all kinds of money," she said.
Figures complied at the RGRTA reflect that Amy's not alone.
While overall rider ship has increased just two percent, it's up 15 percent at the Bushnell's Basin lot. The area's transportation authority isn't sure why, but they are confident that if the gas prices continue to increase, so will the number of riders onboard its busses.
Jim D.
Everyone should use her fuzzy math. One mile, besides being 20min walk would be 10 miles a week wouldn't it? One mile each way, being 2 times a day times 5. Somethings up
This is I believe the third generation Orion VII in the making...the second being the order coming in, the first being the O7s that originally came in and were tested as demos...
But anyway, 6365 is back in NYC, but for a short time, it seems...
Cleanairbus
Incognito
Second Avenue Stubway
Trevor
Although I am not 100% positive, I am pretty sure I spotted this bus on I-80 westbound in the Fairfield/Parsippany, NJ, area around 4:30 on Friday afternoon. I definitely saw a NYCT Orion VII and am pretty sure the only digits I could see on the driver's side were 636. Don't have the foggiest idea what that bus was doing there!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2481329963&category=6728&sspagename=WDVW
Come on, guys. You're in NOVA, so you have more money than I do; how about it? Maybe we can all buy one jointly and I can pitch in. :)
-Fred
But gas may be a "problem" -- as for repairs, all I have to do is shine the Danlight into the sky and a DASH repair chopper will be on the premises in less than 2 minutes.
And Tristan, where have you been? I was hoping to hear from you again!
-Fred
-Fred
On that note, I usually take life's disappointments and turn them into talent through my artistic skills. Last week, I did a drawing of a broken down Grumman 870, leaning and spewing smoke from the engine compartment on the side of the road in a desert. Meanwhile, there's Yours Truly watching the smoldering wreck and calling for help and advice on my cell phone. And the Grumman emblem on the back of the bus is cleverly redesigned to spell "GINNY". :)
Once I get hold of a scanner, I'd like to share it with you et al.
-Fred
If only a woman was as fixable as a Flxible. :)
-Fred
"often buses are far more stylishly attired than most women these days...." Yeah, some women sure do wear ugly crap these days. Guess it's all the more reason to get those clothes on the floor! ;)
"FAR more personality......" I will admit that a lot of women out there have the personality of a dog turd. But some are truly mesmorizing. Believe me, I've met a few of them.
"PLUS buses won't give you hell if you forget a birthday or an anniversary!!! 8-)"
BIG boner to pull with a woman...never done that. However, sometimes remembering can be just as detrimental. For example, Ginny (the girl with the curves) got upset with me because I decided to wash her clothes for her and let her have the day off, but it turned out the ones on the dryer were not supposed to be folded with the clean...because they were still dirty! And on top of that, she left her cake out. To be a good samaritan, I put it in the fridge...but did not stop to think it was an ICE CREAM cake!
I guess my experience here is that women are like buses...if you want to continue to be aroudn them, you have to be VERY careful and take precautions, or you could really have a big accident. :) Guys, don't ever screw up like I did!
-Fred
-F.
I don't know if I'm feeling the Old Look comparison though; the Flxible Metro looks MUCH sleeker and advanced in design. In fact, it still looks newer than any bus manufactured today!
-Fred
-Fred
John
-Fred
*Plus it seems that buses are getting to be very very slow even without the A/C on lately..
-Fred
Overall, a very nice bus to drive! :)
-Fred
Trevor
~A transitfan in suburbia...
The New Flyers definitely seem to do the worst when it comes to high powered a/c time. I rode 56XX the other day - it sounded like a loud 5400 - nothing like a regular 5600 bus. Not to mention it was very sluggish, although since it is a new flyer, sluggish for them means somewhat normal speeds.
One can only imagine what the summer does to a bus...
I disagree with the assertion that the NFIs are bad in the heat, I stood along Pennsylvania Ave wednesday right where it crosses Summit uphill from the R5 Ft Washington Station. The NFIs on the 98 would zip right up the hill, as would 5666 on the 201, while the Neos on the 94 would crawl up it, usually expelling some massive cloud of soot in the process. I saw several NFIs go from a standing start at the base of the hill by Commerce Dr and climb right up the hill. I didn't ride any NFIs in the heat, and thus I cannot comment on the percieved lessened acceleration, but the NFIs appeared no worse than any other buses out there. Now if the buses are running slower in the city or something, then I'd place blame on the superior air conditioning of the D40LFs, the Neotrashes seem to have problems keeping cool, so it's little wonder that they run fast in the summer.
The Roadeo is scheduled for August 1; also, T-shirts left over from our local Roadeo will be handed out, featuring artwork on the back by Yours Truly of a cartoon Gillig stopping at a cone.
DC and Virginia area busfans, come on down; a good time shall be had by all! And maybe you can drive my Flxible Metro on the course. :)
-Fred
As an occasional user of the Lakeland Bus Service. I am wondering if Lakeland even considered how many more riders they would lose to the MidTOWN DIRECT service by discontinuing bus stops in downtown Dover. Lakeland's web site didin't even mention this service change. Currently a round-trip ticket to NY on Lakeland costs $14.80 add to this the fare for the MCM10 or a taxi to Lakeland's terminal, you are looking at maybe $20 to take the bus to NYC, while the cheapest Rail option: traveling to Hoboken and connecting to the PATH is only $13:50 round-trip not including NJT's peak period surchanges. Also, let's not forget that the MCM10 or any MCM route for that matter doesn't run on Sundays or Major Holidays. As of this writing, Lakeland's online schedule for the 46 route still shows service beginning at Warren & Blackwell even though the bus no longer serves that location. Maybe Lakeland's 46 route would be better off as part of the MCM system, and who knows maybe PABCO would extend the 46 route to the Rockaway Mall.
That the Q17 could steal buses from Stengel in an emergency situation when they really needed an extra bus?
David
BIG AL
BIG AL
BIG AL
BIG AL
But read my post on the 9112, confirm if there are more of them coming if you happen to drop by FP.
BIG AL
June 9th Update:
Triboro & Green Lines Roster updated to reflect NYCT units and a new Montgomery County Ride-On Roster has been posted.
Click The Bus To Enter...
Regards,
Trevor Logan
TransiTALK Media Group
Trevor
It was in the notes, "#2004-2005 & 2011 are Ex-MTA NYCT Buses;" I see it's fixed now.
the guy said hopefully the first week of july
go to www.walthers.com search buses-you will see the pictures. hopefully there will be more designs comning out then the 3 they showed.
I presume that you are talking about Fishbowls.
Also will these be models or kits that have to be assembled?
JD
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Ok seriously, the special thing about #3942 that I noticed even before the engine door was the placement of the American flag on the side, in the same place as the 9600s (after repowering), the 21/2200s, and rebuilt 42/43/4400s...
This could mean that 3942 was rebuilt, but I don't have full knowledge of that...it could've been a pre-rehab paint job, or maybe WMATA just wanted to move things around...just keep your eyes out for freshly rehabbed 30' Orion Vs, they may be coming soon.
Included in the listings are:
Fifth Avenue Coach Lines TD4506
Madison Avenue TD4506
Surface Transit TD4506
NYC Bd. of Transportation TD4506
Custom Painted Mabstoa TDH5303
Lionel Lines (NYBS Livery) suburban 5302
San Diego Transit TDH5301
All in excellent condition and ready to go.
DEADBEAT!!!!!! Tells lies about when he's gonna send payment, and then never does. I'm nto the onyl one he stiffed, look at his lousy feedback.
He is supposedly a bus operator with MTA NYC Bus in Staten Island...
BTW, I liked last year's wrap [with Superman] much better.
Buses Rode Today:
8876 F14 to Capitol Heights(very slow acceleration)
2201 96 to Union Station(just missed 8709 on the 97)
2418 D6 to Farragut Square
2004 38B to Rosslyn
2151 3B to East Falls Church(*&?%$@!)
9492 2C to Ballston
2007 38B to Rosslyn
2066 5A to Dulles
67 Dulles to Dulles(no lie, I had a Dodge Ram van 3500 on this route)
56 7to7on7(ODV deluxe, a longer ODV-here is a question, why is it that the more the non bus it is the better the seats)
7926 924 to Herndon P & R
7770 950 to West Falls Church(might have seen someone familiar there)
9323 3B to Rosslyn(bus rattled big time)
took Rohr train set with riding 1133 on the blue to Capitol Heights
2096 F14 home
Saw 4247 on the 3A this afternoon going to Annandale.
I didn't think much of seeing all of those MCIs at WFC until some more rolled in and as we were leaving seeing a couple of more. I was going to bus it through downtown, but with the Reagan thing going on and not knowing which streets were blocked, I decided to take the subway to Capitol Heights. To my shock when I got there around 7:45pm there were no THE BUS buses. :P
Interestingly, Avis at Detroit-Wayne County Airport runs only Gillig Phantoms - none of the LF's in service at that location.
Jim D.
Yes Basman, 8808 maybe in the hands of DUH BUS as we speak.
Hmm, THE BUS is spying on WMATA, is it? Probably trying to find out the secret to operating a system WITHOUT having to use delivery trucks. "How do they do it?" Watch out Ride-On, you are next (for that very brief stretch on New Hampshire Ave). If you see an ODV or SLF parked on Lebanon St, beware. Where do you think they got the idea for Gilligs from?
Watch out for THE BUS...it's coming after you. DASH and PRTC may be safe...for now...
(Bonus picture. The MTA Effect is spreading...)
What exactly do you mean by "MTA Effect"?
Started out by taking 7610 on the B68 to the last stop where I transfer to the F and ride it northbound to 21 St/Queensbridge and a few minutes later I get 645 on the Q19A and the A/C is pretty low so its a relatviely short ride to 30 Av and the Q18 is coming so I get another GM, 685 and the bus is pertty hot with dirty water on some seats. Get off at 69 St to get the Q45 to head north to Roosevelt Av and I take a few pics around the area then walk over to the Q19B and I get on 649 and climate control is satisfactory so I ride it from terminal to terminal and I see 2007 [noticed that signs weren't reporgrammed and had paper signs] getting prepped for service on the Q19. I see the Q23 2 minutes later and get on 3066 and its cool and on 104 St these kids had the pump on and the water splashed the bus and all but one window was open but no one was sitting in those seats and seemed to have stayed dry.
By the 103 St station, the bus gets crowded and then I get off at 62 Drive, just missed 3043 on the Q38 so I have to get in hot ass 695 and stuck with the school kids. We wait 10 minutes before we finally depart and these teens were loud, trying to be cool by playing music [from a cell no less :-\]. Anyway its a steaming hot ride to Dry Harbor Rd where I change for the Q29 and I get 2067 5 minutes later and ride it to the last stop and I just catch the arriving Q33, 2825 and the bus is pretty cold but a slow accelerating bus and I ride north and pass by the garage and noticed the Superfly full wrap on Classic 781 and 770 had the current "lightning stripe" scheme. I wait about 15 minutes for the Q72 to arrive so I get on 3010 and take the ride via Junction to Rego Park to wait about 15 minutes for the Q53 to arrive then when I see 2818, the bus on the inside is a real mess: duct tape covering the front lights and appears to be holding up the Stop Requested sign, electric tape over the yellow strips in the back doors, leaking water in the back and I had to pull the back door when it wouldn't close.
While the A/C was nice and cold and the ride was quick, the interior is a mess and then I see 3067 with its engine door opened then I see 4907 on the BQM1 express just stall on Cross Bay Blvd and that too had its engine door opened, amazing. Anyway no more mishaps for the rest of the way although I do see 2010 on the Q53 heading towards Woodside so the trip is finished then I get on 605 on the Q35, a good ride to Brooklyn but the bus was hot then I ride 8019 on the B41 to Foster Av then take the B8 and finish my trip.
O7 7610 B68
R46 5729 (F)
TC RTS 645 Q19A
TC RTS 685 Q18
TC RTS 723 Q45
TC RTS 649 Q19B
TC O5 3066 Q23
TC RTS 695 Q38
TC RTS 2067 Q29
TC RTS 2825 Q33
TC O5 3010 Q72
TC RTS 2818 Q53
GBL RTS 605 Q35
RTS 8019 B41
O7 7562 B8
Whoa! They had one of those old MTA buses on the Q53 express?!?
Does anyone have the Turn sheets/route descriptions for the 4 Routes,,
Thanks
Steve
Also, when buses are repaired after minor accidents, most times the blue stripe is a much lighter color at the repair site. Why can't they use the same paint for repairs as for total repaints???
These two seemingly minor items can make the whole operation look sloppy, a grave disservice to the professional appearing BO's!!!
Da Hui
So do the passengers, they just want to go fron point A to B but a nasty interior/exterior appearence [like other agencies] does look bad. Anyway its better to keep those comments to yourself ;-).
Some time before this summer is over I am going to take some pictures of some of various equipment used by the operators here on the eastern shore of Maryland. Most if not all of the equipment used out here are not conventional transit busses that one would see in the big city.
John
John
Now, if NJT could sends some Neo artics down to South Jersey and use them on a local route between Cape May and Ocean City via Ocean Drive, then I'd be happy...
(Not that it'd ever happen...)
THE QUEENS RIDING PUBLIC MUST BE HEARD!
Who? All interested members of the general riding public who rely on NYCT and Private Buses for their transportation needs are encouraged to attend. You will hear from your representatives and your bus employees.
When? Friday, June 18th at 7:00 PM
Where? York College Performing Arts Center
94-45 Guy Brewer Blvd., Jamaica
646-539-2071
Why? Because the MTA has merged two completely separate entities into one (The Private Bus Lines Takeover with Regional Bus Consolidation), created their own deadline for accomplishing such and is perpetually lying to you about the reasonings behind it.
Additionally, included within this change of legislation is the stifiling of YOUR VOICE where your bus service is concerned. The MTA has submitted legislation barring you from speaking out against rotten service, dirty and damaged buses as well as given themselves the green light to cut service across-the-board as they deem appropriate without any public hearings or notification!
...BE THERE ON FRIDAY JUNE 18th OR FOREVER HOLD YOUR PEACE...
Directions: E, J, Z, LIRR to Jamaica Center (Parsons/Archer)
Online: http://www.sosqueens.org
Just heard on 1010 WINS, both DOT and the MTA failed to show. So much for being heard. John Liu is vewwy vewwy angwy.
Go figure?
Truth be told, support services and low-ranking administrative types should be the first to be "cut" - long before any discussion of potentially cutting bus and/or subway service to the general riding public. If you were to call-in sick an hour before you're due at work, these people would still get to work on time. Should I do the same, many of them quite possibly would not.
The 'alarmists' you speak of is the rhetoric and banter of MTA itself which you seem to enjoy perpetuating. That dependable, trustworthy and forthcoming agency we have all grown to love and admire.
Have you even seen the bill? I'd wager you haven't. Again, you comment on something you know nothing about. Which is why you can't comment on the issue itself, but rather, since you feel compelled to contribute something, you comment (negatively) upon the messenger of the issue.
MetroB
S T A T E O F N E W Y O R K
________________________________________________________________________
5291--C
2003-2004 Regular Sessions
I N A S S E M B L Y
February 26, 2003
___________
Introduced by M. of A. NOLAN, CLARK, ESPAILLAT, LAVELLE, ORTIZ, SEDDIO,
SMITH, CYMBROWITZ, BENJAMIN, MILLMAN, WEINSTEIN, CUSICK, McLAUGHLIN,
PERALTA, P. RIVERA, GRODENCHIK -- Multi-Sponsored by -- M. of A.
BOYLAND, A. COHEN, COOK, L. DIAZ, R. DIAZ, DINOWITZ, GLICK, GORDON,
GRANNIS, GREEN, GREENE, GROMACK, HEASTIE, HIKIND, JACOBS, LAFAYETTE,
MARKEY, MAYERSOHN, PERRY, J. RIVERA, SANDERS, SCARBOROUGH, TITUS,
TOCCI, TOWNS, WEISENBERG, WRIGHT -- read once and referred to the
Committee on Corporations, Authorities and Commissions -- committee
discharged, bill amended, ordered reprinted as amended and recommitted
to said committee -- recommitted to the Committee on Corporations,
Authorities and Commissions in accordance with Assembly Rule 3, sec. 2
-- committee discharged, bill amended, ordered reprinted as amended
and recommitted to said committee -- again reported from said commit-
tee with amendments, ordered reprinted as amended and recommitted to
said committee
AN ACT to amend the public authorities law, in relation to the transfer
of bus routes operated under New York city franchise agreements to the
New York city transit authority and to establish the New York City
regional surface transit advisory council
THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK, REPRESENTED IN SENATE AND ASSEM-
BLY, DO ENACT AS FOLLOWS:
1 Section 1. The public authorities law is amended by adding a new
2 section 1203-c to read as follows:
3 S 1203-C. TRANSFER OF CERTAIN BUS LINES BY THE CITY TO THE AUTHORITY.
4 1. A. NOTWITHSTANDING PROVISIONS OF THE CHARTER AND ADMINISTRATIVE CODE
5 OF THE CITY OF NEW YORK, ON OR BEFORE JULY FIRST, TWO THOUSAND EIGHT,
6 THE CITY SHALL, BY RESOLUTION OF THE CITY COUNCIL OR BY INSTRUMENTS
7 AUTHORIZED BY ANY SUCH RESOLUTION, ENTER INTO AN AGREEMENT WITH THE
8 AUTHORITY FOR THE TRANSFER TO THE AUTHORITY, FOR USE IN THE EXECUTION OF
9 ITS CORPORATE PURPOSES, OF THE FACILITIES USED FOR BUS ROUTES PRESENTLY
10 OPERATED UNDER FRANCHISE AGREEMENTS WITH PRIVATE COMPANIES NOW OWNED OR
EXPLANATION--Matter in ITALICS (underscored) is new; matter in brackets
{ } is old law to be omitted.
LBD08223-06-4
A. 5291--C 2
1 HEREAFTER ACQUIRED OR CONSTRUCTED BY THE CITY AND ANY OTHER MATERIALS,
2 SUPPLIES AND PROPERTY INCIDENTAL TO OR NECESSARY FOR THE OPERATION THER-
3 EOF. ANY SUCH AGREEMENT SHALL PROVIDE FOR TRANSFER OF SUCH FACILITIES BY
4 DEED, LEASE, LICENSE OR OTHER ARRANGEMENT, PROVIDED THE TERM THEREOF
5 SHALL NOT BE LESS THAN TEN YEARS AND AUTHORIZE THE AUTHORITY TO TAKE
6 JURISDICTION, CONTROL, POSSESSION AND SUPERVISION OF SUCH TRANSIT FACIL-
7 ITIES, MATERIALS, SUPPLIES AND PROPERTY ON OR BEFORE JULY FIFTEENTH, TWO
8 THOUSAND EIGHT.
9 B. BEGINNING JULY FIRST, TWO THOUSAND EIGHT, THE NEW YORK CITY TRANSIT
10 AUTHORITY SHALL BE RESPONSIBLE FOR PROVIDING BUS SERVICE TO THE AREAS
11 FORMERLY SERVED BY THE BUS ROUTES IDENTIFIED IN THIS SECTION.
12 C. SUCH AGREEMENT SHALL PROVIDE THAT CAPITAL COSTS OF A NATURE NOT
13 HERETOFORE CHARGED AS OPERATING EXPENSES SHALL BE PAID BY THE CITY, OR
14 AT THE OPTION OF THE AUTHORITY MAY BE PAID IN THE FIRST INSTANCE BY THE
15 AUTHORITY BUT IN SUCH EVENT, THE AUTHORITY SHALL BE ENTITLED TO RECOVER
16 FROM THE CITY THE AMOUNT OF SUCH COSTS; PROVIDED, HOWEVER, THAT THE
17 TOTAL AMOUNT OF SUCH CAPITAL COSTS WHICH THE AUTHORITY MAY INCUR WITHOUT
18 THE APPROVAL OF THE MAYOR IN ANY CITY FISCAL YEAR SHALL NOT EXCEED FIVE
19 MILLION DOLLARS AND THAT NO OTHER SUCH CAPITAL COSTS SHALL BE INCURRED
20 BY THE AUTHORITY WITHOUT SUCH APPROVAL. WHERE THE CITY IS REQUIRED TO
21 REIMBURSE THE AUTHORITY FOR THE AMOUNT OF ANY CAPITAL COSTS PURSUANT TO
22 SUCH AGREEMENT, SERIAL BONDS OR CAPITAL NOTES MAY BE ISSUED BY THE CITY,
23 PURSUANT TO THE LOCAL FINANCE LAW, TO FINANCE ANY SUCH REIMBURSEMENT IN
24 THE SAME MANNER AND TO THE SAME EXTENT AS IF SUCH COSTS WERE TO BE PAID
25 DIRECTLY BY THE CITY.
26 THE AUTHORITY SHALL SUBMIT ANNUALLY TO THE CITY PLANNING COMMISSION
27 AND THE MAYOR OF THE CITY ON OR BEFORE OCTOBER FIFTEENTH IN EACH YEAR AN
28 ESTIMATE OF ALL SUCH CAPITAL COSTS FOR INCLUSION IN THE CAPITAL BUDGET
29 OF THE CITY.
30 D. SUCH AGREEMENT SHALL PROVIDE THAT THE AUTHORITY SHALL HAVE THE USE
31 AND POSSESSION OF ALL PROPERTY OWNED OR LEASED BY THE CITY AND USED OR
32 OCCUPIED ON JULY FIRST, TWO THOUSAND EIGHT IN CONNECTION WITH OR INCI-
33 DENTAL TO THE OPERATION OF SUCH BUSING FACILITIES.
34 E. SUCH AGREEMENT SHALL INCLUDE PROVISIONS PROVIDING FOR THE RECOGNI-
35 TION OF EXISTING LABOR AGREEMENTS FOR THE TERM OF THE AGREEMENT AND THE
36 RIGHTS AND BENEFITS THAT FLOW FROM SUCH LABOR AGREEMENTS, AND ALSO FOR
37 THE CONTINUED REPRESENTATION OF EMPLOYEES BY THE RECOGNIZED COLLECTIVE
38 BARGAINING AGENTS.
39 F. SUCH AGREEMENT SHALL PROVIDE FOR THE CONTINUATION OF SUBSIDY FUND-
40 ING FROM THE CITY OF NEW YORK AT THE AMOUNT PROVIDED FOR IN THE CITY`S
41 TWO THOUSAND TWO--TWO THOUSAND THREE FISCAL YEAR, IF THE AUTHORITY
42 ASSUMES OPERATION IN FISCAL YEAR TWO THOUSAND THREE--TWO THOUSAND FOUR.
43 IF THE AUTHORITY ASSUMES CONTROL AFTER THAT, THE AMOUNT OF SUBSIDY PAID
44 BY THE CITY SHALL BE THE SUM OF THE AMOUNT PROVIDED IN TWO THOUSAND
45 THREE--TWO THOUSAND FOUR AND AN ADJUSTMENT EQUAL TO THE SUMS OF THE
46 ANNUAL CONSUMER PRICE INDEX FOR THE NEW YORK METROPOLITAN REGION AS
47 DETERMINED BY THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF LABOR MULTIPLIED BY THE
48 AMOUNT PROVIDED IN TWO THOUSAND THREE--TWO THOUSAND FOUR. THE AMOUNT OF
49 SUBSIDY PAID FROM THE CITY TO THE AUTHORITY IN SUBSEQUENT YEARS SHALL
50 ALSO BE SO ADJUSTED ANNUALLY. THE CITY OF NEW YORK SHALL INCLUDE IN ITS
51 EXPENSE BUDGET FOR THE FISCAL YEAR COMMENCING ON THE FIRST DAY OF JULY
52 TWO THOUSAND FOUR, AND IN EACH EXPENSE BUDGET THEREAFTER, AN APPROPRI-
53 ATION OF TAX LEVY FOR SUCH BUS SERVICE PROVIDED BY THE NEW YORK CITY
54 TRANSIT AUTHORITY AND PAY THE NEW YORK CITY TRANSIT AUTHORITY NOT LESS
55 THAN ONE HUNDRED SEVENTY MILLION DOLLARS FOR THE OPERATIONAL COSTS OF
56 SUCH BUS SERVICE; PROVIDED, HOWEVER, THAT FOR THE FISCAL YEAR COMMENCING
A. 5291--C 3
1 ON THE FIRST DAY OF JULY TWO THOUSAND FIVE, AND THEREAFTER, FOR EACH
2 FISCAL YEAR COMMENCING EACH SUCCEEDING JULY FIRST, THE AMOUNT SHALL BE
3 ADJUSTED TO TAKE ACCOUNT OF INCREASES IN THE COST OF PROVIDING SUCH BUS
4 SERVICE. THE NEW YORK CITY TRANSIT AUTHORITY SHALL SUBMIT A BUDGET TO
5 THE CITY IN TIME FOR THE MAYOR`S EXECUTIVE BUDGET, DETAILING THE ANTIC-
6 IPATED EXPENDITURES OF THE TAX LEVY FUNDS APPROPRIATED BY THE CITY FOR
7 THE COMING FISCAL YEAR.
8 2. THE CITY AND THE AUTHORITY ARE HEREBY AUTHORIZED AND EMPOWERED TO
9 MAKE OR ENTER INTO ANY CONTRACTS, AGREEMENTS, DEEDS, LEASES, CONVEYANCES
10 OR OTHER INSTRUMENTS AS MAY BE NECESSARY OR APPROPRIATE TO EFFECTUATE
11 THE PURPOSES OF THIS SECTION AND THEY SHALL HAVE COMPLETE POWER AND
12 AUTHORITY TO DO AND TO AUTHORIZE THE DOING OF ALL THINGS, INCIDENTAL,
13 DESIRABLE OR NECESSARY TO IMPLEMENT THE PROVISIONS OF THIS SECTION.
14 3. UPON THE FILING BY THE AUTHORITY WITH THE CLERK OF THE CITY AND THE
15 SECRETARY OF STATE OF A COPY OF THE INSTRUMENTS OR DOCUMENTS EFFECTUAT-
16 ING THE TRANSFER, THE AUTHORITY SHALL TAKE POSSESSION AND CONTROL OF THE
17 BUSING FACILITIES AND OTHER PROPERTY TRANSFERRED THEREBY TOGETHER WITH
18 ALL CONTRACTS, BOOKS, MAPS, PLANS, PAPERS AND RECORDS OF OR IN THE
19 POSSESSION OF THE BOARD OF TRANSPORTATION OF WHATEVER DESCRIPTION, INCI-
20 DENTAL TO OR NECESSARY FOR THE OPERATION OF THE FACILITIES TRANSFERRED
21 BY SUCH AGREEMENT OR THE PERFORMANCE OF THE DUTIES OF THE AUTHORITY AS
22 PROVIDED BY THIS SECTION.
23 4. EFFECTIVE JULY FIRST, TWO THOUSAND EIGHT EMPLOYEES OF THE COMPANIES
24 OPERATING THE ROUTES DESCRIBED UNDER PARAGRAPH A OF SUBDIVISION ONE OF
25 THIS SECTION SHALL BE TRANSFERRED TO THE AUTHORITY. SUCH EMPLOYEES
26 SHALL BE SUBJECT TO THE PROTECTIONS AND THE PROVISIONS OF THE CIVIL
27 SERVICE LAW AND SHALL ALSO BE MEMBERS OF THE NEW YORK CITY EMPLOYEES`
28 RETIREMENT SYSTEM.
29 S 2. The public authorities law is amended by adding a new section
30 1204-b to read as follows:
31 S 1204-B. NEW YORK CITY REGIONAL SURFACE TRANSIT ADVISORY COUNCIL. 1.
32 THERE IS HEREBY CREATED THE NEW YORK CITY REGIONAL SURFACE TRANSIT ADVI-
33 SORY COUNCIL TO STUDY, INVESTIGATE, MONITOR AND MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS
34 WITH RESPECT TO THE MAINTENANCE AND OPERATION OF SUCH SURFACE TRANSIT
35 SYSTEM. SUCH COUNCIL SHALL STUDY AND INVESTIGATE ALL ASPECTS OF THE DAY
36 TO DAY OPERATIONS OF SUCH AUTHORITY, ITS SUBSIDIARIES AND THE OPERATING
37 AUTHORITY, MONITOR THEIR PERFORMANCE AND RECOMMEND CHANGES TO IMPROVE
38 THE EFFICIENCY OF THE OPERATION THEREOF.
39 2. SUCH COUNCIL SHALL CONSIST OF NINE MEMBERS WHO SHALL BE REGULAR
40 USERS OF SUCH TRANSPORTATION SERVICES. MEMBERS SHALL BE APPOINTED BY THE
41 GOVERNOR. ONE MEMBER SHALL BE APPOINTED UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE
42 MAYOR OF THE CITY OF NEW YORK, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE SPEAK-
43 ER OF THE ASSEMBLY, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE TEMPORARY PRESI-
44 DENT OF THE SENATE, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE PRESIDENT OF THE
45 CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF NEW YORK, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE
46 QUEENS BOROUGH PRESIDENT, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE BROOKLYN
47 BOROUGH PRESIDENT, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE BRONX BOROUGH
48 PRESIDENT, ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE NEW YORK STATE AFL-CIO AND
49 ONE UPON THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE NEW YORK STATE BUSINESS COUNCIL.
50 EACH OF THE MEMBERS SHALL SERVE FOR A TERM OF TWO YEARS.
51 3. THE MEMBERS OF THE COUNCIL SHALL RECEIVE NO COMPENSATION FOR THEIR
52 SERVICES BUT SHALL BE REIMBURSED FOR THEIR EXPENSES ACTUALLY AND NECES-
53 SARILY INCURRED IN THE PERFORMANCE OF THEIR DUTIES PROVIDED FOR IN THIS
54 SECTION. VACANCIES OCCURRING IN THE MEMBERSHIP OF THE COUNCIL SHALL BE
55 FILLED IN THE SAME MANNER AS ORIGINAL APPOINTMENT.
A. 5291--C 4
1 4. THE COUNCIL MAY REQUEST AND SHALL RECEIVE FROM ANY DEPARTMENT,
2 DIVISION, BOARD, BUREAU, COMMISSION, AGENCY, PUBLIC AUTHORITY OF THE
3 STATE OR ANY POLITICAL SUBDIVISION THEREOF SUCH ASSISTANCE AND DATA AS
4 SHALL ENABLE IT PROPERLY TO CARRY OUT ITS ACTIVITIES AND EFFECTUATE THE
5 PURPOSES SET FORTH IN THIS SECTION.
6 S 3. This act shall take effect immediately.
.SO DOC A 5291C *END* BTXT 2003
David
:-)
The original bill calls for a transfer of NYCDOT-owned facilities to NYCT. The last we heard, the current setup calls for NYCT to LEASE the facilities from NYCDOT, at least at the outset. To me, outright transfer sounds like the way to go. We'll have to see what the final bill contains.
David
This PBL takeover initially began as Regional Bus, dating back to 1996 contractual obligation to 'discuss such'. Later, in 1999, it was agreed by and between the union and agency to commit to certain agenda. It was only recently that the PBL takeover "overtook" RBA! As indicated above, the idea of RBA/RBC has been on the table long before discussions of a PBL takeover were suggested. I still don't understand why some claim it exists only here, but that's neither here or there.
Now, since the two are on the table simultaniously, it makes sense for the MTA to attempt to combine/consolidate the issue into one. That's not the problem- the problem is the change in original legislation, the new authority governing the new entity, the loss of rights of the riding public and much, much more (that yes, affect me as an employee). That, and the fact that a PBL takeover doesn't require RBA at all! And, it has a cost to the taxpayer, where the PBL takeover does not (as outlined in legislation).
So, your guess is as good as mine. We're all waiting to see what happens.
Look, folks- you don't have to agree, disagree or argue with me about this issue. You have an opportunity to hear first-hand by those who operate your bus service and represent you locally. Why not come down to the meeting and hear for yourselves? As I understand it, the Unions will join with local Representatives and host your questions upon completion of the address period.
Now before you go jumping all over me as you did "Yorkie" and "Gotham Bus", let me say that, no, I did not see the bill. However, as far I as I know (and I am working VERY intimately with the DOT takeover--any questions me on this issue from the cdta's of the world will be ignored, by the way), D-Day for us is 7/1/04. That is what DOB is preparing for and that is what Planning is prepping for. I only read about Regional Bus Company here.
So, when "Gotham Bus" talks about alarmists, I think he is referring to the fact that there are no plans in the works to alter bus service in the immediate future. LI Bus is not currently involved in this nor is Bee Line or Suffolk County Transit.
I've always liked your contributions here but, cool your jets, man, you're becoming the Rev. Al of BusTalk.
Mark
Way back in the day, a Metropolitan Suburban Bus Authority was proposed. Only Nassau County bit. Everyone else kept their service locally. Now Long Island Bus has MetroCard and Westchester WILL get it because they have been complaining about Nassau County's freebies. If Westchester and Nassau, both ADJOINING New York City has or will get the same farecard system and if both are seeking financial relief from their responsibilities in varying extents, what will be the next logical step in state assistance? State operation. There is no other step necessary in Nassau's case and there is one step that will be cleared in ~24 months in Westchester.
Whether you are a public or private operator, you do not plan on a year to year basis. However, to say that such isn't being worked on is false. There are events pointing to the contrary.
That may very well be true. Although considering most on this board are not privy to such information, it's not suprising. I don't place very much weight in what I read on this board. My information comes from a wide variety of sources- you being among them for certain aspects, such as scheduling. However, my contacts extend much further and wider than "BusTalk" acquaintences. From Albany, to Brooklyn, from union leaders across the spectrum to MTA NYCT DOB managers of many levels and positions.
Now before you go jumping all over me as you did "Yorkie" and "Gotham Bus", let me say that, no, I did not see the bill.
I wouldn't jump all over you. You post pertinent and relevant information. However, since you haven't seen the Bill, how can you comment on what it does or doesn't contain?
However, as far I as I know (and I am working VERY intimately with the DOT takeover--any questions me on this issue from the cdta's of the world will be ignored, by the way), D-Day for us is 7/1/04. That is what DOB is preparing for and that is what Planning is prepping for. I only read about Regional Bus Company here.
Regional Bus is not something that the MTA currently wishes to be made transparent. Your duties don't warrant the need to know at this time. Your duties WILL require that knowledge sometime in the future. However, since it's being as tightly-kept-under-wraps as possible, factual information that can be made public proves difficult- for me anyway, because I would rather post a reference source as opposed to "I've heard". Since I cannot and will not disclose any source, I will not make a statement other than what's already been issued- either by one or more of the various unions or TA management.
Secondly, you've proved a valuable point without realizing it. Since you're working closely on the takeover issues, and know little if anything about RBA, that's a pretty good indication it's not a necessary part of the takeover. For details about the RBA comingling, give Balsamo or Seay a call.
RBA has nothing to do with the DOT takeover, which is why the DOT has no information about it.
So, when "Gotham Bus" talks about alarmists, I think he is referring to the fact that there are no plans in the works to alter bus service in the immediate future. LI Bus is not currently involved in this nor is Bee Line or Suffolk County Transit.
I don't know that SCT will be involved in RBA at all. I haven't heard that agency mentioned. LIB and BLB will be involved at a later date. As for Gotham, he can speak for himself.
MetroB
Tom Kelly (212) 878-7440
METROPOLITAN TRANSPORTATION AUTHORITY ANNOUNCES HISTORIC RESTRUCTURING
Peter S. Kalikow, Chairman of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority, today announced a restructuring of the Authority, designed to further improve services to its customers. The initiative, with the most sweeping changes in the Authority’s 37-year history, will result in the merging of various umbrella agencies into five distinct companies under the MTA, each with a single transportation mission.
The restructuring, which will begin immediately and be phased in over a two-year period, will result in the creation of the following companies:
MTA Rail Road, formerly Long Island Rail Road and Metro-North Railroad
MTA Subway, which will include NYC Transit (subways) and Staten Island Railway
MTA Bus, formerly Long Island Bus, MaBSTOA, and NYC Transit (buses)
MTA Capital, in charge of overseeing system expansion projects for all MTA companies
MTA Bridges and Tunnels
“We have an obligation to the public to spend each dollar wisely, and we have come a long way in the past few years. With this initiative, many millions of dollars will be saved when it is fully implemented,” Mr. Kalikow said. “MetroCard and E-ZPass have changed the way New Yorkers think about their travel patterns. More people are using mass transit than in the past, yet congestion remains a major challenge for our region. We need to employ creative solutions to these challenges in order to maintain New York’s competitive position in the national and global economy.”
Today’s announcement marks the beginning of a multi-faceted initiative designed to streamline the MTA, reduce redundant administrative functions, and provide clear and concise corporate missions for each new MTA company.
“We need to move beyond our past and focus on where we are going,” said Katherine N. Lapp, Executive Director of the MTA. “We need to be faster and more responsive to the changing travel patterns of our customers as envisioned by Governor George E. Pataki’s Master Links strategy.”
“The MTA collectively employs about 62,000 people. The Authority does not expect the restructuring to result in a dramatic change in that figure. No MTA collective bargaining agreements will be unilaterally changed by the restructuring plan, which will be submitted to the State Legislature for approval by the end of the year. In addition, union representation will continue to be determined by the wishes of our employees,” Mr. Kalikow said.
“In my two-year tenure as Chairman of the MTA, I’ve been impressed each and every day with the quality of the MTA workforce. Today’s announcement is an enormous undertaking, but who better to undertake it than the people who got us here,” Mr. Kalikow said.
MTA Rail Road
The MTA currently oversees two separate rail companies, the Long Island Rail Road (LIRR) and Metro-North Railroad (MNR), each serving a different metropolitan region. The LIRR, created in 1834 and part of the MTA since 1968, provides service between Manhattan, Nassau and Suffolk counties, as well as parts of Brooklyn and Queens. It transports 306,200 riders each weekday, up from 259,200 in 1995.
MNR, formerly Conrail, joined the MTA in 1976, and services seven New York and two Connecticut counties. MNR transports 252,600 riders each weekday, up from 217,400 riders in 1995.
“Merging the two railroad managements into a single structure will help create a more efficient railroad, one with a broader regional focus,” Mr. Kalikow said. “The stabilization and expansion of the region’s economy require a regional approach to the provision of commuter rail services and the new MTA Rail Road will provide that focus well into the 21st century.”
“The merge will also help streamline administrative services and result in a more uniform implementation of inventory, equipment, maintenance, and customer strategies,” he added.
MTA Subway
NYC Transit currently operates the most extensive and largest subway system in the nation, with 660 track miles and an estimated fleet of 6,000 subway cars. Since 1996, annual subway ridership has climbed from 1.13 billion passengers to more than 1.4 billion due to the elimination of two-fare zones, introduction of the MetroCard and new discount policies which reduced the average cost of a subway fare from $1.32 in 1997 to $1.06 today. The system’s aging subway fleet is being replaced with state-of-the-art computerized cars that provide riders with a better quality and more efficient ride.
“The renaissance of the system, from a run down, inefficient, and unsafe system, to one which has received national recognition for the most improved transit system among the largest systems in the country, is nothing short of remarkable and is a tribute to those who run the system day in and day out,” Mr. Kalikow said. “It is that spectacular record of accomplishments that we expect to maintain and build under the new plan.”
MTA Subway will operate the New York City subway system and the Staten Island Railway, which currently serves 14,000 Staten Islanders each day. The Staten Island system covers 14.3 miles of track and has 64 cars.
MTA Bus
The MTA currently provides bus services in the metropolitan region through Long Island Bus in Nassau County with 399 buses, and MTA NYC Transit with 4,700 buses in its two separate bus divisions, one for Manhattan and the Bronx, and another for Brooklyn, Staten Island, and parts of Queens.
“Surface transportation is a critical aspect of the provision of public transit for many metropolitan residents, and as such, the MTA is embarking on the creation of a single MTA Bus unit designed to bring these functions under one corporate entity,” Mr. Kalikow said.
“NYC Transit has experienced a 43 percent increase in bus ridership since 1995,” Ms. Lapp said. “The MTA needs to meet this demand by creating one corporate entity with a mission to develop system-wide bus routing for all MTA customers regardless of jurisdictional boundaries. The new MTA Bus will also concentrate on developing enhanced services in order to improve the quality of the ride for all passengers.”
Once the newly merged Bus company is established, consideration will be given to having non-MTA transportation providers, including private bus companies that operate in New York City and throughout the MTA service region, join the MTA. These changes would require the agreement of both the MTA and local governments where the non-MTA providers operate.
MTA Capital
The MTA has embarked over the last few years on an extraordinary program of system-wide expansion. East Side Access will bring the LIRR into Grand Central Terminal; the Second Avenue Subway will extend from Harlem to the Financial District in downtown Manhattan; and the extension of the No. 7 subway to the West Side will spur development in the area. Other projects include access to Penn Station by Metro-North; studies are also currently being conducted to analyze commuter rail access to Lower Manhattan. A president, whose mission will be to advance these projects, will head the new MTA Capital company.
“Moving any one of these projects forward would be challenging, but moving forward simultaneously while handling the already existing $17 billion capital improvement program presents even greater challenges,” Mr. Kalikow said. “The new MTA Capital company will provide a single point of focus to allow us to advance system expansion with a coordinated approach that tells New Yorkers we are serious about getting the job done, on time and within budget.”
MTA Bridges and Tunnels
MTA Bridges and Tunnels currently operate seven bridges and two passenger car tunnels that are used by 293 million vehicles each year. The successful implementation of E-ZPass has allowed Bridges and Tunnels to reduce waiting time for E-ZPass customers by more than 50 percent, with non E-ZPass customers experiencing delays ranging from one to six minutes per vehicle. MTA Bridges and Tunnels will retain its current corporate structure.
I was afraid that it had been reencoded as a transfer, but it's still a valid 30-day unlimited (or the little that's left of a 30-day unlimited).
Depending upon exactly how far along within the channel the card was stuck is the difference between "pushing" your card up, and encoding a transfer.
It's a chance he was willing to take because... it's not his card. We can't see how far along it is unless we open the side panel. What he should have done in the first place.
I never issue a transfer as a means to dislodge a jammed card. Next time, ask that the driver NOT do so, but instead, open the door and thumbwheel it out.
Next time, you could walk away with a transfer :-)
We've grown very accustomed to the "right-arm-dumps-the-bin-while-the-left-hand-holds-the-wheel' annoyance of these defective fareboxes.
The S.O.P. is to contact supervison to notify of the issue and await instruction. There are farebox defects that do require the bus removed from service. Each situation has a different response, but only supervision may approve/disapprove/instruct such.
couple more examples here..
Sign like that for the Q31 on the SW corner of 48 Av-Bell Blvd as well
Forget about the second one.
JD
BIG AL
No, it's 1848.
Yup; 4219 (formerly Omni*Bus 1) has no digital sign, just a placard reading "Hospital Audiences, Inc."
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
HAI!
Just a hunch.
Did you happen to notice the original bus number that (apparently) has the first digit ("9") and the third digit ("2") removed, leaving only the center ("7")?
Yes, along with the residue from the "966" removed from the destination sign door and A/C cover. I'm guessing the panel above the headlight is all that remains of 972.
Which reminds me; I need to update this thread.
The first bus that is all white with the Hammerhead destination sign is from Capital District Transportation Authority in Albany, NY. It's a 1991 B.I.A. Orion Model 01.509 (300 Series), renumbered 770. Here is a link to the TransiTALK CDTA Photography Page....Click Here
Here is a photo of said Orion Is in Albany prior to retirement. Photo by Trevor Logan.
The second bus with the Red & Black paint scheme is from Red Rose Transit in Lancaster, PA. It's a 1990 Flxible Model 35096-6T METRO "B", the original number is 966 but the Crown Heights Community Bus people have renumbered it also to 770 which tells me it might actually be thier line number. Here is a link to the TransiTALK Red Rose Photography Page....Click Here
Here is a photo of the Red Rose Flxibles at the Red Rose Facility prior to retirement. Photo by Trevor Logan.
The thrid bus is a MTA-NYC Bus #1846 which is a 1982 GMC Model T8J-204 RTS. It's operated by the Hospital Audience Group. I don't know exactly what thier capacity is, but they have a second bus numbered 4219 which isnt from the MTA. The two buses are stored at the Jackie Gleason depot which is why they sport JG Logos.
Here is 1846 before it became a HAI Bus. Photo By Kevin Barsky.
I hope this has helped you.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
"HAI's Omni*buses are uniquely designed transit vehicles, specially adapted to accommodate severely disabled and frail elderly people. Each Omni*bus can hold five people in HAI's special stretcher beds, or up to ten people in wheelchairs, or 37 frail ambulatory people, or flexible combinations of all three."
They used to be numbered Omni*Bus 1 (4219) and 2 (1828). I also seem to remember the two having different configurations a couple of years ago, and now they're both "flexible combinations."
I like uniquely painted buses, however, like LYNX in Orlando.
B8-#7595-Orion VII
Chuck Greene
Chuck Greene
I disagree, Chuck. I don’t mind full advertising buses, but I hate having the windows covered. The view is severely obstructed from inside the buses and LRV’s I’ve ridden. I find that my eyes hurt after a while if I’m trying to look outside through the wrap for too long. There’s plenty of space on the sides of the buses for an advertising message without having to cover the windows.
Jim D.
Chuck Greene
I rode the PTO shuttle yesterday - the strip thing is crazy, although you can see very clearly through the strips. however, it was interesting that the strips themselves were opaque.
I think I prefer the mesh because it is more consistant/flowing...
hey, shrink wrapped buses are nice for the occasional bus, but the worst thing is when companies have wrapped buses as part of their normal scheme. I think wraps are starting to become overused nowadays.
Take pride in the transit scheme!
Chuck Greene
Regarding wrapped buses, I tend to think that they peaked in the mid-late 1990s. Maybe it's just me, but I notice far fewer wrapped buses today than I did five years ago. Maybe transit systems wised up and realized that cheezy advertising gimmicks were not worth compromising the comfort and dignity of their passengers -- or as I call them, customers.
What have become more common are "almost" wraps, where the ad covers everything except the windows. I don't love these either, but at least anyone inside the bus can't tell the difference.
Some transit systems never got into the whole wrap fad. I don't think NYCT ever did any, except for "diaper" wraps on the back. CTA does a lot of almost wraps, but I don't think they allow anything over the windows. I think WMATA tried them, but ended up applying them only to soon-to-be-repainted 9600-series Orions. In many more areas, communities rejected them as sight pollution. Anyone else know of TAs who never wrapped buses?
As for visibility from the interior, you don't realize how bad they are until you ride an unwrapped bus. Yes -- you can see out the windows of a wrapped bus, but you have to squint sometimes and the awkwardness of light gives you a headache. Then you board a bus with unobstructed windows and say 'This is SOOOO much better!'
I'm glad that TAs are wrapping less and less. It's important that the public see transit vehicles as transit vehicles, not as ad whores for products already advertised ad nauseum.
Proud to be a transit fan. And proud to be a Democrat!
One advantage though. It will serve to identify the bus (or subway car) if it's ever hijacked to Mexico.
What is ugly:
Wrapped buses with the front or rear left alone
attempts for wraps on windows that slide
I love that HAI wrap on that RTS bus though - it's the funniest thing I've ever seen on a bus!
I think there's two types of ads out there. One with the annoying holes, and one that's more like pigmented tinting. There were some buses, like LYNX Orlando, I don't remember seeing any holes, and their big thing is shrinkwrapping all the buses. I noticed the tinting on one the last time i was there, was like a screendoor mesh, maybe that's the difference. But they're definately not bad whatsoever.
But I can understand the need to gain revenue from them, especially for the cash-strapped TTC which gets almost no government funding.
Now that I think about it, I don't mind full-length ad wraps as they aren't as intrusive IMO.
but many others that truly ruined the appearance of the bus, as well as obscuring the views from inside.
I can see just fine on QSC RTS' and Orions that have been ad-wrapped, but then again, it was probably the material used.
But, I guess, times bieng what they are, the transit angencies are looking for ANY source of added revenue.
Like via fare hikes...
I believe they are also going to shrink wrap the stations, farecard machines, seats, drivers and passengers as a way of generating $1 billion in revenue.
Peace,
ANDEE
As far as the 5851-5950 series, I'd expect at least Comly and Southern to get the bulk of those buses, with the rest probably going either to Red Arrow, Frontier, or both.
It could be a matter of training drivers on the 5700s before they show up on the 44, but there's only a handful of them going to Callowhill so they may be spread out throughout the Callowhill routes (but it looks like they're mainly staying on the 38, which ends at Wissahickon Park, which may be why the bike-rack equipped 5700s are showing up there).
WMATAGMOAGH: why did u call me earlier?
xxxxxxxxx: oh, i need to know where the 56 went, going in the direction of wakefroest..but i got it...
Well, if the 56 has to go all the way to North Carolina and back, no wonder its reliability is what it is. It is the second longest route Ride-On has ever run. The now eliminated 27 was the longest, going all the way from Friendship Heights to the Bahamas via Little Falls and Dorset.
Metro Sets Ridership Record; Braces For Another
Reagan Viewing Surpasses Clinton Inauguration
A new ridership record for Metro has been set.
The transit agency says 850,636 trips were taken on the subway Wednesday.
Metro spokesman Steve Taubenkibel said that shatters the previous record of 811,257 trips taken the day of President Bill Clinton's first inauguration in January 1993.
Metro said it hasn't had any major problems handling the large volume of people.
The transit agency said Thursday could be another one for the record books.
Meanwhile, rush-hour service began early again Thursday for Metro -- and it could last most of Friday.
The transit agency said it began running six-car trains at 1 p.m. instead of the usual four-car trains. The trains also will run more frequently. Metro won't charge peak fares during the added rush hours.
Metro also plans to increase its service Friday. That's when parts of Constitution Avenue, Massachusetts Avenue and other streets in Northwest will be closed as President Ronald Reagan's casket is moved from the Capitol to the National Cathedral.
Spokeswoman Lisa Farbstein said Metro will operate six-car trains until 7 p.m. Friday, if necessary.
Metro also said it will continue running free shuttle buses Thursday night from RFK Stadium to the Capitol, where Reagan's body will lie in state until Friday morning. Those buses will run from 11:30 p.m to 6 a.m.
NYCT Orion V #404
Bee-Line Orion V #404
Queens Surface Orion V CNG #404
Pelham Bay Station.
--OR--
LACMTA RTS #2222 (now retired)
Long Beach Transit D40LF #2222
OCTA NABI 40-LFW #2222
Downtown Long Beach.
Downtown Flushing.
Jamaica-165 St Terminal
That's ok, we had 11 of our MMM's out of service yesterday. Can't wait to get rid of those things!!!
4271 is a Landover bus, probably did a P12 route earlier in the day and the sign got stuck or it is just that they have now extended the P12 from Addison Road to Silver Spring.
On another WhyMATA note 2017(PIKE RIDE bus) was seen again on the P6, going towards Rhode Island Avenue
I was thinking about this but I believe every type of WMATA bus currently operating has now operated on the even 30s except the artics. Can anyone think of anything that may have not operated there at one time?
That bus must be Long Island Bus 2004 Orion 05.501.
I'm still thinking up some good questions to ask him, but does anybody here have any suggestions of some good bus-related queries you want answered? I think I'll ask him to get on the DOT's ass to finally replace Queens' run-down bus stop signs, with the newer ones that are all over Manhattan and Staten Island.
But be realistic...he's not the head of the MTA, and he ain't gonna know when the delivery of the artics of O7s will resume.
"If the city can afford to build an arena that will be in use eight to ten days a year, can it afford a central terminal for all the bus routes that serve the Flushing subway terminal- hence sparing people from having to walk up to two very crowded blocks just in time to see their bus pulling out?"
Not bus-related, but-
"Do you care that you're costing my family money by having your meeting at the school in which my wife works in the P.A.L. after-school program, causing the cancellation of said program for the day you're coming? My wife only gets paid when she WORKS. As it is, she lost a day's pay this past January when the schools were ridiculously closed over an 8" snowfall! Is this your way of exacting revenge because I didn't vote for you in 2001?"
Why don't you come to the meeting? It's gonna be at 214 Tuesday night at 7:30. There's probably a notice in your building.
And here is something a little extra....
Enjoy!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
So what's the deal with these blue signs?
So if I see it again, I'm gonna get a harder look!
Trevor
BIG AL
I guess the Reagan funeral wasn't creating enough area road closures/detours/delays...
By Lyndsey Layton
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, June 11, 2004; Page B01
Metro's budget committee endorsed a plan yesterday to raise fares and fees at the end of the month but added a new twist: The rail system would open a half-hour earlier on weekdays, at 5 a.m.
On a 7 to 2 vote, the directors who make up the budget committee agreed to raise the minimum subway fare by 15 cents to $1.35 and the local bus fare by a nickel to $1.25. The weekly bus pass would remain unchanged at $11.
The maximum peak rail fare would rise 30 cents to $3.90, and daily parking fees would increase by 75 cents. Monthly reserved parking would rise by $10 to $45.
The full Metro board is to vote Thursday on the increases, which would take effect June 27 and mark the second year in a row that fares and fees have gone up. Transit officials expect the fare increases will cause about 14,000 rail passengers and 3,200 bus riders to stop taking public transportation.
Metro directors, faced with a projected $23.4 million deficit in an operating budget of about $940 million, endorsed $29.2 million in fare increases. They said the surplus would be returned to the local governments that help fund Metro.
"You've asked for a fare increase, and then you send the money back to local governments," said Gordon Linton, a newly appointed board member from Montgomery County who was federal transit administrator under President Bill Clinton. "I find that highly unusual."
In the package endorsed yesterday, Metro would also charge a premium fare from 2 a.m. to 3 a.m. on Saturdays and Sundays, but trains would run on an off-peak schedule. Currently, off-peak fares are charged during that hour.
Disabled and elderly passengers who use MetroAccess, the curb-to-curb service, would see a 10-cent increase in their base fare to $2.50. But anyone accompanying a MetroAccess-eligible rider on Metrorail or Metrobus would be able to ride free -- an offer that transit officials are hoping will encourage more disabled riders to take the regular transit system. For the first time, MetroAccess riders traveling beyond the service area defined by federal law would be charged a premium of up to $4 per ride.
Opening the subway at 5 a.m. weekdays instead of 5:30 is expected to attract about 1,700 riders, transit officials said. The earlier opening would begin in September and would cost the local governments that subsidize Metro about $700,000 a year.
The two directors who voted against the fare and fee package, Chris Zimmerman of Arlington and Jim Graham of the District, said the increases were excessive.
"I cannot support any increase in Metrobus" fares, said Graham, a D.C. Council member who represents the Adams Morgan neighborhood, which is heavily served by bus lines. "We're raising $29 million, but we're insisting that $1.8 million come from bus riders who are least able to afford this."
Zimmerman called the fare increases "sneaky" because during extensive public hearings this spring, Metro officials presented a range of increases but pledged they would not seek the maximum amount. In the end, that's just what they did, he said.
"It hurts our credibility, to tell people we're going to do one thing and then we turn around and do the other," Zimmerman said. "I don't think that's the right way to do business."
© 2004 The Washington Post Company
Is this true that the Orion Vs are going to be running on the Bx10 now? And if so, where are the RTSs gonna go (I know that the two 1987 TMCs, 4795 and 4797 will probably be retired in 2007)? TIA.
Trevor
Da Hui
SAS
you're correct. KB did indeed 400 and 401 very briefly then they went to Stengel. KB also had 93077 (177) for a short time before their '93 Orion Vs arrived
The pic of #5716 (the sign was fixed, as I said earlier) is below.
I also notice that there has been slightly less scratchitti on the windows. Also, unlike Gun *Cough Cough* Hill, KB does not have any vandal bus operators. Rarely any dead light tubes either.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
Even so, I would like to pay a visit to the WF routes that have the Orion VIIs with the orange LED signs (7700 series?). I like the orange LED signs.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
Yeah, pretty much. Nothing else is really worth getting excited about.
The 96'Novas are my favorite, then the 98'Novas, then the 95'Orions(esp. JG's CNG's). The 99'Novas don't really impress me.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
Is this true that the Orion Vs are going to be running on the Bx10 now? And if so, where are the RTSs gonna go (I know that the two 1987 TMCs, 4795 and 4797 will probably be retired in 2007)? TIA.
Whoops, forgot the signature.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
Regards,
Trevor Logan
Photos are below:
Trevor
#3267, 3275 and 3278 are still running in service and can always be seen during rush hour. #3267 can sometimes be seen during the day, they use it for training.
Jason
87 (NYCT 1673), two months ago
Did one of those RTS buses from DART happen to be #288? If that's one of the ex-DART buses you're referring to, it now has a home down here. It's used in revenue service by Krap(f)'s Coaches on its Coatesville to West Chester line run along with two Thomas TL960's which could easily be in worse shape than anything "DUH BUS" runs down in Prince George's (maybe the chimp moonlights for Krap(f)'s) and a 1979 GM RTS (w/squareback) that was once a Methanol test bus, in addition to various cutaway (ahem) buses that show up on nights and weekends.
I think the RTS that was (and still is) #288 was formerly DART #151, but I'd have to double check that to be sure. FWIW, it still runs pretty fast, but they did take out the electronic sign and replace it with a third-rate roll sign...
If you're interested, look under my seller id....sjh50
THANKS!!
Later on in the day, I was at Medical Center. The train operator announced that this train was a "Red Line to Silver Spring":-)
And this one needs no introduction:-)
It's this new company called Vamoose Bus. It picks up at Tenleytown Metro station and McPherson Square Metro station, and drops off at Madison Square Garden (W 31st St btw 7th and 8th Ave)
The man in the blue jacket was the ticket agent.
The passenegers were all, well, not the typical chinabus crowd. Just look at the locations where it drops off and picks up at. I counted roughly 30 caucasian passengers and two asian passengers, one of them being me. I got a free ride from Tenleytown to McPherson Square, courtesy of a nice driver:-) He also drove down Massachusetts Avenue quickly, but safely. They charge the same fares as chinabus ($20 one way, $35 round trip), and the driver says it takes 4 hours to get to NY, the same as chinabus. The driver also pulled a very chinabus-esque move and waited for this one passenger at McPherson Square to run out, buy a banana, and come back to the bus so she doesn't get left behind.
I may try it out sometime.
There is also that Russiabus operation that runs from Brighton Beach, Brooklyn to Northeast Philadelphia, but it uses MC-9s and makes only like two trips a day...
UPenn has a few ex-NYC RTS buses. Does that qualify?
Remember -- the Flxible Metro was one of the best-selling buses ever. Countless transit operators large and small bought them en masse until Flxible died in November 1995. This means that a great many of them do not even qualify for retirement, on top of those older units still soldiering on because they're darn fine buses. It's not too hard to find late 1980s Flxs still active at various systems. Some particularly Flx-heavy properties are New Jersey Transit, CTA, MdMTA and WMATA. And let's not forget all of those smaller systems which run big-city grade buses. I had the pleasure of driving a 1991 Flxible in regular service this morning at a 43-bus system!
-Fred
-Fred
-F.
In true Flxible fashion, they were 35-footers with roll signs. :)
-Fred
-Fred
-Fred
I need to get my hand on one of them magnets, or a pen(had a CATAbus pen). I'd call in sick from work if i could get one(i NEED a weekday off!!)
-Fred
-Fred
What transit angency has the largest operating fleet of Metros?
CTA(Chicago Transit Authority) has the largest operating fleet of Flxible metros today.
-Fred
Well I had no idea that a 1996/1997 bus is considered antiquiated :-\. And I've seen a lot of grumbling by passenegers [mainly the elderly] whenever I ride the B3.
Mark
David
David
It's similar on the subway. The 1/9 and 2/3 draw similar crowds over similar distances, but a crush loaded 1/9 is much worse than a crush loaded 2/3, because the 1/9 has many more opportunities over that distance for extended dwells.
If the aisle/seating arrangement on the suburbans is responsible for increased dwell times when the bus is crowded, then it's best to use the suburbans on the routes that don't make very many stops while crowded.
A related point is that an overcrowded bus can't accept new passengers. An overcrowded local might have to flag all stops except where a passenger rings the bell, becoming a de facto limited and starving the passengers waiting at local stops of service they're supposed to have. An overcrowded limited is likely to make most of its scheduled stops anyway, since passengers will want to get off at most of them.
This might sound silly, but if the buses must remain in service and can't be reseated, how about simply removing the seats (and platform, if possible) on the right side of the bus and installing handrails along the exposed wall? It's not ideal, but the resulting bus would be able to carry large crowds with no problem.
As for the suggestion, the big expense is in removing the platforms -- seats aren't that hard to install and they can be obtained from buses going to scrap. I doubt it would pay to remove just one of the two platforms.
It should also be remembered, as I said elsewhere in this thread, that a given bus might (probably will, really) make both local and Limited trips during its time on a Limited route.
David
This problem occurs at all times of the day not just rush hour. that is why i ussually choose to take the b2 from kings highway and walk
1)The B3's schedule created by observations of ride checkes who due the outdated manual method of bus observation, takes too small of a sample to accurately schedule this route.
- Part of the problem is two variables west of Garritsen ave.
Marine Park - The schedule does not take into consideration that the 1/2 mile stretch crossing marine park both eastbound and westbound can be crossed at a greater rate then the other mostly retail portion of the ave. What this does is allocate too much time for the run from garritsen to E71th street and too little run time for the part of the run from garritsen ave to Harway ave Bensonhurst.
Kings Plaza - The schedule also does not take into account that kings plaza does not open 9:30 am - 9:30 pm and that significant riders too and from does not occur until 10 am. What happens is that buses harway ave bound have a habit of leaving terminal late and making up the time flying thought the section of the route between e71th and garritsen .
In the morning buses ofter come early or in bunches and end up hiding a few blocks before the ride check at Nostrand ave. In effect when the driver crosses nostrand ride check he is on time giving the impression that all is well. This significantly hurts riders becasue drivers who leave terminal late could be getting riders down to the e 16th train station quicker and in addtion if the secound driver leaves on time, he passes the first driver to pad his ridership number and then hides a few block before nostrand so that he does not get penalized for being early. There is one run that this happend on every morning. I have observed this pattern on my days off as well
Going bergen beach bound the pattern is the opposite. Two little run time from bensonhurst to Garritsen cause bus bunching with buses catching wach other at e16th train station. On average buses that are supposed to arrive bergan beavh bound at 7 min intervals often arrive at 15 min intervals causing crowded conditions.
I have studied the traffic issue as well. Although Ave U has many double parked cars at times when the stores are open. This delay issues occurs as late as 10 PM when most stores have been closed for hours and the double parking issue is not an issue,
2) As for the secound bus passing the first bus. The reason the driver does not pass is the secound bus is AHEAD OF SCHEDULE thus the driver would be penalized for being early. When the first bus runs late that bus is picking up riders the secound bus should pick up causing the secound bus to run early.
Wheelchair riders is not an issue on this line. There are not that many wheelchair riders on the B3.
The solution is a better schedule that addapts to the unique nature of this line. This is difficult to put together using ride check data which takes a too small a sample of the line operations
Automated bus monitoring and dispatching would also help.
-It would allow the secound bus to take the first buses time slot if it catches it(remember the secound bus is ussually fairly empty) more evenly distributiing the rider load. Taking the time slot would mean that the secound bus passes and does not pickup riders until it is at the point in the route where the first bus should be. This allows the line to more quickly get back on schedule and reduce future delays caused by the earlier delay
-It would give an infinite amount of bus running data that would illustrate the behavior I just described.
3) the antiquated way the MTA uses bus checkers sitting on a street corner to track buses. Drivers who are early routinly hide a few blocks and then move ahead to be tracked on time. A complete fraud
NYCT ride checks cover every trip, in both directions, that is operated over an entire operating day (in the case of really large routes, sometimes the checkers cover odd-numbered runs one day and even-numbered runs another -- something of which Ralph Kramden would be proud < g > -- but the B3 is not large enough to require such treatment). Unless something major (like an accident or bad weather) happens that knocks out several hours' worth of data, all the information collected is used and analyzed. The schedulemakers look for, and adjust, aberrations (for example, one bus taking 15 minutes to go between a pair of timepoints while everybody else is doing it in 7 or less), but by and large the information is accepted as-is. Proposed running times are then developed based on the results of the analysis, and these running times change throughout the day.
And, by the way, Kings Plaza and Marine Park are both EAST of Gerritsen Avenue, not west. The major traffic congestion problem on this route is between Coney Island Avenue and Ocean Avenue, with the area between Ocean and Nostrand Avenues being a secondary problem. Also, if buses are leaving their terminals early, that is not a scheduling problem, it's a supervision problem unless they're being ordered to do so BY supervision (in which case, supervision should tell the Route Manager, who, if he/she determines that the supervisors are doing the right thing, should tell Schedules there is a problem).
David
With the trains, you can make some inferences and get origin-destination data. That is, the station you board at on your second trip of the day could be inferred to be the station you exited on your first trip of the day, unless there was a bus trip in between.
But you don't swipe at bus "stations," just on the bus. Is there any plans to syncronize the farebox with the route, perhaps through GPS, so it would be possible to figure out how many people use different portions of the route automatically all the time?
David
One day of data is not enough to determine a pattern. Weeks or months worths of data at each location along the route is needed to make a good schedule. Something that can not be done with manuall ride checks. This is just applying the laws of probability. In additon GPS overlays that show the buses actual position and metrocard data are needed to determine whether a driver is making phantom stops. This is needed and is data that can be had only with an autoated system
The manual ride checks do not caluculate how long a bus take to travel from in each section of the route for which is one of the problems with the B3.
the bus line is poorly timed and scheduled. A better more accuarate schedule would reduce the bus bunching problem. Eliminate it entirly no.
As for the heavy delays eastbound. You can see CI ave from east 16th street Q station. The B3 is delayed prior to that point.
It is a mute point about the ineffecincy of ride check. Once auotmated bus monitoring is in effect in the near future, most of the ride checkers will be reassigned or layed off.
If the ride checks are so accurate, then how do you explain the continually poor bus schedule that does not reflect accurate runing time on the B3
The Traffic Checkers record data for every stop they pass, timepoint or not, so it is possible to track the progress of the bus as it goes through the various parts of the route.
As to the schedule being 'continually poor,' the same driver is not likely to find exactly the same traffic condition on exactly the same part of the route at exactly the same time every day on ANY route. While NYCT tries to compensate by providing adequate recovery time at the end of the route (so the next trip can start on time even if the bus arrived late at the terminal), occasionally something will happen that only adequate supervision can fix. This route has fixed-post supervision at 86th & Stillwell and at Kings Plaza, but the 86th & Stillwell post is not covered before 11 AM or so, and the Kings Plaza post is also covering several other routes (including one -- B47 -- for which reliefs must be monitored).
David
B3 also is watched at Nostrand Avenue, but the Dispatcher's also watching the B44 and B36 routes.
David
BIG AL
David
BIG AL
Actually, that's one of the things I was thinking of as a factor in the route's occasional unreliability.
David
The manual ride checks do not caluculate how long a bus take to travel from in each section of the route for which is one of the problems with the B3."
Listen King Who Thinks He Knows It All But Doesn't,the ridechecks cover EVERY SINGLE STOP FROM TERMINAL TO TERMINAL!We count every person;adult and child;that get on and off every stop and write the times the bus leaves every stop RIGHT DOWN TO THE SECOND!OK?
And on top of that,we cover the same bus route several times every year and every month and twice a week and so forth.The way we do it now is as great a way as there is possible.What leads to a buses poor performance is several things like traffic and BO's "playing games" with each other causing one bus to pick up the other's load focing said bus to be late when it can be on time.W/C lifts is another factor and the list goes on.
GET IT?
GOT IT?
GOOD!!!
Da Hui
Peace,
ANDEE
For how long? 1 week, 1 months. That is not enough data to make accurate schedules. Just look how poorly buses stick to schedules now. That includes all the extra minutes put into the schedules to make the buses look on time.
As for the computerized system replacing ride checkers. Yes it will, but the money still needs to be spent. Mostl likely on more bus service
You do not no anything about statistical sampling and planning
My uncle's worked at various levels of management in the bus and subway divisions with a combined 35 years of experience. I know exactly what a traffic checker does and it is a highly ineffecient way of collecting data that is fundamentally flawed and outmodeled.
Da Hui
You mean to say you know what a traffic checker does because your uncle worked at various levels of management in the bus and subway divisions with a combined 35 years of experience?
Da Hui
Sorry for change of subject.
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
Don't be surprised that the Soft Seat RTS and the Orions will replace the Liberty Lines and NYBS buses once the takeover is done.
This is my opinion only.
Thank You
I ued to never see exp. seating on local routes. Then, in the early 90's, Ulmer Pk began doing it with some of the older fishbowls. Now, it has become quite common over there.
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
B1-#8892-NOVABUS
At one point, NYCT seemed to be concentrating Ulmer Park's RTS expresses on the B1 route, but now it seems to be distributing them more equitably throughout the depot's local routes.
David
Including more appearences on the B6 during the rush hour [and other hours] too, in which they were basically non-existant; at least from my observations.
And worse than the discomfort to standees is that the first few standees invariably stand near the front of the bus, so the bus starts flagging stops when there's still a lot of room for more passengers -- they just can't get to it unless they board through the rear door.
I'm glad to learn they're not being concentrated on the B1 anymore. (I can't imagine why they'd ever have been concentrated on the B1.)
Those babies swallowed up the crowds better than anything out there these days!
With trips like that, I don't see why suburbans would be deliberately placed on the line. Certainly it doesn't make sense to use suburbans on the trippers, which only run during the crowded times.
Do routes like the B64 and B74 often get that crowded? I've only ridden the B64 once and I've never ridden the B74, but from the little I've seen, it doesn't look like the suburbans would fill up on those lines.
But wherever they go, please clean and reupholster those seats. At this point they're disgusting.
The B64 has moderate ridership and as for the B74, it sees it share of crowding at different times and at most times both routes have suburbans dominating their routes.
But wherever they go, please clean and reupholster those seats. At this point they're disgusting.
That I agree on, it is a disgusting sight seeing all of the green foam all over the floor, fluids getting on seats, duct tape and we get the picture....
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
To be Continued.
Yukon: Hell no
Castleton: Hell no
JG: Impossible, they don't want any more RTS's
Flatbush: Maybe, the B41, B44, and B46 limited can use them
East New York: I don't think so. Those soft seats wouldn't last more than a week in ENY. The areas that ENY routes pass though would destroy them. Maybe that's why they are only Brooklyn depot to never see suburbans.
Fresh Pond: Right now they are getting 9111-9139. If it's possible to fit more Novas in FP, these suburbans would do very well on every route, except the Q58.
B1-#4774-TMC
B64-#9315-NOVABUS
by the way, only 2 buses out of all the buses assigned to the B64 today were not coaches. those were #9092 and #4854.
Anyway, there are about 50 of these coaches at Ulmer Park. The combined total vehicle requirement for routes B4, B64, and B74 on weekdays is under 30 (less on weekends). The rest (most of them at any rate) would still have to go somewhere, although I agree that filling up those routes is a good place to start.
David
Only Brooklyn depot? How about the only depot, along with maybe Mother Hale (among depots open since 1998) to NEVER have a suburban EVER on the roster. However, I see it as an issue of ridership. East New York has no true light ridership lines that could use them (except for maybe the B83, and one word the MTA loves to hear is flexibility, which is squashed on here.)
I am not sure if Coliseum or Amsterdam had a suburban. However, ENY is the only TA depot to never have a suburban.
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
I would have taken pics, but my phone is currently at a local nokia repair center, thanks to the 3600's self destructive software.
Did whichever depot these buses came from give them a nice parting present, knowing what they were in for at their arrival at GH, or is Gun Hill becoming more efficient in its bus destroying tactics?
Well the buses where ight at MCH and WF for the most part. But its GH.
What is the X-80 route and where does it go?
Event Transportation Information
Randall’s Island Park
Bus:
Special X80 event buses will leave for Randall’s Island from Lexington Avenue and East 125th Street,and run at regularly scheduled intervals or as dispatched. Round-trip bus fare is $4.00, payable upon boarding using a Standard or Express Bus MetroCard or coins. Fare policy and charge per direction varies with each event.
By Council Member Baez
Whereas, Technology can be utilized to enhance public safety, reduce and deter criminality, and discourage false complaints against the City of New York; and
Whereas, Terrorism has become a more serious threat since the September 11 tragedy with growing concerns that New York City’s public transportation system is a prime target; and
Whereas, The Metropolitan Transportation Authority (MTA) has enhanced security measures since September 11, 2001, and since the Madrid bombing in March 2004, have installed more surveillance cameras in subway stations and tunnels; and
Whereas, The Federal Bureau of Investigation issued a Homeland Security bulletin in April 2004 to police departments around the United States warning that terrorists might try to bomb rail lines and buses this summer; and
Whereas, The bulletin states that transit officials can improve security on trains and buses by reviewing security camera footage each day for signs of terrorist surveillance; and
Whereas, While installing cameras on city buses can improve tracking of terrorist activities on these vehicles, the cameras can also serve to monitor and deter daily municipal problems such as assault, harassment, vandalism and false “slip and fall” incidents inside and outside the buses; and
Whereas, Several transportation authorities in other municipalities have installed cameras in buses including in New Orleans, Louisiana, where officials have used video evidence to help convict people on an array of gun, theft and fraud charges; and
Whereas, Other municipalities with cameras in buses include Minneapolis, Minnesota, San Francisco and Sacramento, California, Charlotte, North Carolina, Seattle, Washington, Burlington, Vermont, Lancaster, Pennsylvania, and Southbend, Indiana, the last three of which have installed cameras in school buses; and
Whereas, These cameras can be installed on bus ceilings and directly behind the driver to send out a radio signal that a police officer can intercept with a modified laptop and monitor the activities of the bus in “real time” or download the information to review later; and
Whereas, Currently neither the MTA, New York City Transit, nor the Manhattan and Bronx Surface Transit Operating Authority has installed any cameras in New York City buses, but has reportedly been in discussions with a French-based company that is outfitting Paris-area buses with surveillance equipment, now, therefore, be it
Resolved, that the Council of the City of New York calls upon the Metropolitan Transportation Authority, New York City Transit, and the Manhattan and Bronx Surface Surface Transit Operating Authority to install cameras on all its buses.
RR; LS 754; 6/01/04
This will bring an end to the ugly vandalism on our buses.
this is a must. Immediate responce to a crime and consistant enforcement is needed to change behavior
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
BAN THE BAN!
By Council Members Lopez, Baez, Barron, Foster, Martinez, Sanders, Seabrook, Quinn, James and Gerson
..Title
Resolution calling upon the Metropolitan Transportation Authority-New York City Transit to reduce the number of articulated buses used in New York City and replace them with non-articulated buses sufficient to meet the ridership demands, as articulated buses increase passenger capacity but fail to increase the number of seats for disabled passengers.
..Body
Whereas, the Metropolitan Transportation Authority-New York City Transit (MTA-NYCT) first began testing articulated buses on routes such as the Bx1, along the Grand Concourse in the Bronx, in the late 1990's; and
Whereas, MTA-NYCT first introduced articulated bus service on the M79 and M86 cross-town Manhattan bus routes in 2000; and
Whereas, Since then, articulated buses have replaced standard buses on ten other routes in Manhattan and the Bronx; and
Whereas, The longer buses have greater carrying capacity, thereby allowing the buses to run less frequently; and
Whereas, Articulated buses are twenty feet longer than standard buses, requiring MTA-NYCT to lengthen or remove certain bus stops to accommodate them and inconvenience riders, especially senior citizens; and
Whereas, While on standard buses wheelchair accessibility is adequately provided through the rear doors of the bus wheelchair accessibility on articulated buses is provided through the front doors; and
Whereas, the Multiple Sclerosis Society, in correspondence submitted to the City Council, asserted that the front door wheelchair accessibility on articulated buses is more time-consuming, cumbersome, requires additional passenger cooperation and causes the disabled greater difficulty in maneuvering onto and off the bus; and
Whereas, Both articulated buses and non-articulated accommodate two wheelchairs at any time, resulting in a transportation system that actually accommodates fewer wheelchairs; and
Whereas, On average 63,000 riders use wheelchair lifts a month; now, therefore, be it
Resolved that Metropolitan Transportation Authority-New York City Transit shall reduce the number of articulated buses used in New York City and replace them with non-articulated buses sufficient to meet the ridership demands, as articulated buses increase passenger capacity but fail to increase the number of seats for disabled passengers.
1. Does the City Council ever come up with legislation that has anything to do with things over which it actually HAS jurisdiction?
2. Did the City Council members who sponsored the bill remember that the City gives hundreds of millions of dollars a year in operating and capital subsidies to NYCT, therefore giving the City Council a fiduciary responsibility to pressure MTA to spend the money as efficiently as possible, a concept of which this legislation flies in the face?
3. Exactly how many times are both wheelchair positions in use at the SAME TIME, on standard buses and on artics? I know some routes see more wheelchair lift use than others (M15 being a prime example), but in 20+ years of riding lift-equipped buses I don't think I've ever seen both positions being used at the same time.
David
Still, it's quite infrequent. I'm not sure that aspect alone warrants reduction of articulated service.
Yet, like all of us, the City Council has a job to do. They would be remiss in their duties if a draft-bill was rejected without due process when their constituents bring forth a *legitimate and logical* argument or case. Legitimate and logical being subject to opinion, I suppose.
Would any Bus Operators here who have driven buses with rear-door lifts AND buses with front-door lifts (or any wheelchair users who might be here) like to comment as to which are easier for customers to negotiate?
David
With rear WC boarding, I may keep the front doors closed, encourage those wishing to alight to use the rear before I begin lift operation and tend to that individual with the attention they deserve. Front door loading is both dangerous and an obstacle.
In my opinion.
At Rockland we had to get out the bus and operate the lift which is just as time consuming as getting up and going to the rear.
The Gilligs and the Orion 1s they had, had the lift in the front, I could do a W/C Cycle in under 3 minuts and be gone.
With the lift in the rear, about 5-6 minutes and with the MCI lift on the outside, just shy of 7 minutes.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
Still, I prefer the rear.
Second main point, the artics have THREE wheelchair positions, in addition to a wheelchair ramp that cannot jamb, unlike that of the RTS.
I won't even bother to read the rest of this until city council can learn to freakin count and get their numbers straight.
Nice find, Brooklyn67
Are you crazy. There is two wheelchair positions on D60HF. Whilst 3 seats CAN flip up on the D60HF, its only two wheelchair positions.
Trevor
strange indeed...
There are two sets of three-seat folding seats (on the RTS anyway). Each set of three seats holds one wheelchair passenger.
Maybe they don't understand that some lines NEED the artics on 3 minute headways, and putting a 40 footer on a line like the BX12 or 22 spells h-e-l-l, no matter what time of day they do it.
They are just grandstanding to hope to get thier name out their to run for another office with it's do little work schedule and outragious pension which by the way can not be taken away even if you are convicted of taking bribes
Thier are some issues with articualted buses and the handicap. A more reasonable solution would be to add more wheelchair seats or some other logical solution
this constant argument of seniors, handicap and poor people can;t do this and can't do that is sickening. They are playing on peoples sympathies
At a hearing Friday, council members said they are furious the MTA has not shown up to any of their scheduled meetings to answer basic questions regarding the takeover.
“I think it’s bad public policy. More important, it’s disrespectful,” said Councilman Joseph Addabbo. “It’s a bad sign of things to come, and I am concerned. This is a bad sign that they're sending out right now, and I'm outraged. It's horrible. If we are going to be disrespected like this as a group I think something has to be done.”
“We have been given no assurances that there will be no reduction in bus service and no disruption come July 1st - that is not acceptable,” said Councilman John Liu.
MTA officials say they have not testified before the City Council because they do not want to jeopardize negotiations with the bus company owners.
City officials would also not testify at today’s hearing. In a statement, a mayoral spokesman said: "We are in the midst of complex and delicate negotiations with the private bus owners. Testifying would disrupt those negotiations and could jeopardize the July 1st transfer."
Many questions remain, such as what will happen to roughly 400 non-union employees who work at the private companies. They were told they would be hired, but none have been contacted yet.
Some workers who are unsure whether they will have a job after July 1st say it's getting harder and harder to concentrate on their work.
“It's like coming to a funeral every day," said one bus line employee.
“It's very stressful,” said another. “The other employees are very upset. The work product is not as good as it should be right now, because no one knows where they stand July 1st."
With their future uncertain, workers this week filed a lawsuit in Queens State Supreme Court, hoping to block the MTA takeover. They've also asked the U.S. Department of Labor to step in.
Council members argue the MTA's actions are unfair to the 400,000 New Yorkers who rely on buses to get to and from school or work every day.
Many other issues remain unresolved. For one, the MTA says it needs legislation passed in Albany before the takeover can happen.
But time is running out, so the council is preparing, if necessary, to extend the life of private bus lines by three months.
“I'm feeling more and more compelled to extend that authority for another period simply so that the MTA and the administration can get their act together," said Liu.
T-19 days.
you can not negotiate with a private party in a public forum. that is a reciet for disaster. the city concil once again is trying to justify it's existence and thier cush $75k plus perks (bribes) useless jobs.
Negotiating in public will drive up the cost.
The short term cost of the takeover will be eclipsed by the long run savings and more importantly better buse service.
The city concilis just looking for grandstanding sound bites. They want to grill the MTA on such issues as route consolidation.
Every inteligent poster on Bus talks knows that their are routes that duplicate each other and need to be consolidated. The city concil just want to a forum to scream save out duplicate service which in most cases is a detriment to it's constituants in the tune of higher fairs and reduction of other more important bus and train service.
Think of the tooken booth closing issue. We all know that 95% of the riders have thier fair before entering the fair control, station agents don;t deter crime, in fact they are often sleeping in the booth when they are needed most overnights. But the city concil was making outragious unfounded claims.
that is why the MTA is not gong to the city concil. THEY DON'T NEED TO and it will hurt negotiations. i am sure the city concil will quickly forget that the DOT routes are run poorly and they are the ones overseeingthem currrently
The City Council has to approve the City's Budget and that includes the money that the City allocates to the MTA. You can't ignore the City Council especially since they can now issue an order for you to appear and if you don't are subject to criminal porsecuation.
Basically the correct thing for the DOT and the MTA was to request a Committee meeting in Executive Session which meant any information given is privilaged and not for the public's knowledge.
That's my opinion
Thank You
That would be valid if the State had passed the enabaling legislation.
The MTA doesn't want to come out and say "Yes we're going to cut service" especially after raising the fare to $2 and getting ALL of the subsidy money that the privates were getting, plus getting the new buses the privates were denied, and having the real costs of the take over being between $500 million and $1 billion.
Any inteligent poster on bus talk, would realize this especilly if they were a resident of NYC and had to pay taxes. You may not like the private lines, but you'll absolutely HATE it when your taxes have to go up for this debacle!
"Any inteligent poster on bus talk, would realize this especilly if they were a resident of NYC and had to pay taxes. You may not like the private lines, but you'll absolutely HATE it when your taxes have to go up for this debacle"
The biggest tax wasting debacle are some of the unreasonable work rules in the MTA union contracts such as the one that stipulated that overtime shifts must originate from the drivers home depot no matter where the service is to be provided
lets get it straight. The city concil had control of the DOT routes and they poorly managed the suppoervision of its operations in exchange for campaign donations. If the MTA takes over the privated those campaign donations go out the window.
If you want to create an MTA that best serves the people of this city, through out the current union contract and start from scratch with the taxpayers of this city in mind. The same holds true for the union contract I work under.
Now as far as Unions costing the city money, well being that we are some of the least payed workers in transit, and in the professional trades (I make as a mechanic $23+/hr, MTA makes $24+/hr, metro north makes $29+/hr, Con Edison make 30+/hr)we're actually a bargain. But then I guess I should be grateful that I have a "Nice" cardboard box to live in. What world do you live in that you haven't seen the price of milk double, the price of houses triple, parking tickets double?? It costs money to live in this city!!! And it's the social programs that burden the city's budget, not Unionized labor! If you have a 40 hour work week, decent wages, health care, and a retirement, then you have UNIONS to thank!!! All of those things weren't handed out by management or big business(remember child labor, or is that the good ole' days?), they were fought for, and yes even people died for them. But if someone is living in their parents basement, then I could see why they would treat them with such disregard!
Do you realise that you get those tickets for braking the law?
Arti
And make sure your air conditioner isn't too loud, that'll cost you $440 first offense!
But then again, your breaking the law!!
No it's the owners of the "privates" companies that are going out the window. What remains is the continued employment of the staff (union/non-union), the route structure, etc.
BTW, legislation is required to create a new operating authority for the private lines. The issue though is with another bill for the creation of RBC, which may die in committee because the MTA will not answer questions.
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
They could use the existing law that created Manhanttan and Bronx Surfice Transit. This was done in 1980 when the MTA tookover the Avenue B and East Broadway Transit Company at the end of March when that company went out of business.
Thank You
Peace,
ANDEE
All of a sudden Mr. Cooper is concerned for his employees? Where was his concern a few years ago when he and his fellow owners were going to shut down operation, lock, stock and barrel.
The MABSTOA was created in the early 1960's to take over the operations of the 5th Avenue Coach/Surface Transit Company bus lines. The laws which created this entity can be used to operate the private lines now in the process of being taken over by the MTA.
While they're at it, the MTA should take over the Westchester County Bee Line system; what a disgrace that is. Bus service on many lines, once every two hours, minimal or no service on weekends.
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
I was checking out the express bus routes that the MTA run out of Staten Isalnd and Brooklyn. It appears that the schedules I saw listed are only for weekday service. Is this true? There is no weekend service on the express busses? Being from the Bronx, I don't know.
It also makes me wonder if that is the case, will that mean there will no longer be any weekend express bus service much further down the road if/when MTA takes over.
Just wondering....................
If the MTA really wanted to, they could discontinue all express service except to Staten Island (where it could erupt into a political keg).
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
X-12 does not operate weekends
x-27 is being retained as the funding was linked with the x-28
Thank You
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
Da Hui
The X17C runs weekdays and Saturdays. I noticed a strange error in the
The X17C runs weekdays and Saturdays. I noticed a strange error in the X17/x19 .pdf schedule. Go to page 4 and the locations are mixed up. (It's impossible to run from Richmond Ave/Lamberts Lane to Midtown Manhattan in 16 minutes flat.)
The X27 and X28 are being funded to allow weekend service.
Where as the city who owns the lines is transfering the authority to state. This is by choice, not necessity.
Don't know just asking.
And by law they do have to. The city council has hit the MTA with a subpoena, they have to show now!
The City is still going to be expected to kick in millions for the service that the TA will be providing, so the Mayor/City Council will have some say about what is going to be done with their money ?
Virginian - Pilot
Jun 09, 03:03 AM
IT'S 2 A.M. and the tour bus is speeding through the barren roads of the Eastern Shore.
Passenger Cheryl Ford weaves through the aisle and sleeping travelers' dangling arms and legs. No easy trek to the restroom - the bus is zooming along at 70 mph, blowing through an occasional red light, trying to reach New York City from Virginia Beach in six hours.
Ford gets to the door and realizes it's stuck. She pulls as hard as she can without losing her balance. She asks a nearby passenger for help, but he just shrugs; he doesn't speak English. Ford is forced to wait. But that's probably best: The restroom is basically a hole in the wall, with a bucket for hand washing.
For $20, Ford wasn't expecting any frills. Or a quiet night ride. The driver's cell phone rings constantly. Reruns of a Taiwanese variety show loop on overhanging television screens. And the bus lurches when making three stops at Wal-Marts and a Food Lion to pick up passengers.
If you're a picky traveler who's fond of confirmation numbers and schedules, this is not the ride for you.
But it could become the bus line of choice for people in Hampton Roads who want tickets based on price and travel time. Two Chinatown, New York-based bus lines have started running between Virginia Beach and the Big Apple. They leave after midnight and get to New York by dawn. They are a third of the price of a Greyhound ticket and take half the time.
"For $20, you could go every weekend," Ford says.
If customers like Ford begin taking the maverick lines in numbers, Greyhound could be in for a battle here in Hampton Roads. In other cities where the cheaper Chinatown-based bus lines have cropped up, particularly Boston, Greyhound has taken them head on, dropping fares and increasing the number of direct routes to Manhattan.
"We will adjust based on market demand and whether it makes sense from Greyhound's standpoint," says Greyhound spokeswoman Kim Plaskett.
A comparable ticket on Greyhound costs $70 each way, or $49 if bought a week in advance. There are no express buses to New York from Greyhound's Norfolk terminal, although Greyhound offers as many as 10 departures daily. The ride ranges from almost eight hours to more than 12, depending on the route and the number of stops.
Meanwhile, the two Chinatown lines, operated by Today's Bus and New York SouthEastern Bus, offer a daily departure and arrival in Hampton Roads. Prices range from $20 to $50 each way, and can be bought on board or online for a small handling fee at Ivymedia.com, which is operated by a company in Cambridge, Mass.
So far in Hampton Roads, the Chinatown bus lines have been mostly popular with the Asian-American community. But that could change, if customers like Ford have a positive experience and tell their friends about it.
Ford decided she would be the first of her group of friends to try the Chinatown bus. If she likes it, her co-workers vowed to try it. She said she's looking for a safe ride that doesn't make too many stops.
"Ask me when I get off," she says, as the long white tour bus pulls into the parking lot this March night.
Ford is the first passenger to arrive, getting there about five minutes before midnight.
She steps out of her husband's white minivan into the dark parking lot beside Four Seasons Oriental Grocery at Kellam Road and Virginia Beach Boulevard. The 30-something Jamaican native is dressed in an ankle-length plaid skirt, dress shoes, turtleneck and fur coat, with full makeup and not a hair out of place. She looks more like she's ready for church than a six-hour bus trip .
A few weeks earlier, a co-worker said she had seen a sign at the grocery store advertising non-stop bus service between Hampton Roads and New York City for $20.
"We laughed at her," Ford recalls in her native accent. "We said, 'You're crazy Michelle. Twenty dollars?"
It was true, and Ford said she couldn't pass it up.
She had spent twice as much on Greyhound tickets visiting family in New York, and the ride took almost twice as long. Those trips had taken a toll on her the last two years, when she lived in New York and was visiting her then-fiancee here in Hampton Roads regularly.
The next to arrive is smiling Sim San Chan. She, too, heard about the bus service through the sign on the grocery store. The 61-year- old is looking for a convenient way to see family in New York. She's gotten there by air, rail and Greyhound, and now she wants to try "Old Tiger," the name of the Chinatown-based bus.
"It's not the price," she says, her accent still thick despite 30 years in Chesapeake. "It's good for me. My family live in Chinatown area. No hassle."
She takes a seat at the front of the bus and greets passengers as they board. She is excited for her middle-of-the-night trip.
Old Tiger looks like it's been in the tour bus business more than a few years, with the '70s-colored velvet seats on a raised platform, above the driver's head. There are five television screens, three on the left, two on the right. It is clean, with plastic shopping bags slung on the armrest of the aisle seats for trash. There's not a lot of leg room, but there are enough seats for all who want to take the ride.
At 12:21 a.m., the bus starts to fill up. All - save Ford - are Asian, and they are of all ages, from the stylish college-aged student on her cell phone to parents with two young toddlers. The littlest one plays hide-and-seek behind the tall seats, her fountain- shaped pony tail crowned by a pink bow appearing and disappearing at the front of the bus.
Just before 12:30, the scheduled time of departure, Ford decides to make a dash for the 7-Eleven next door to buy some headphones so she can listen to her tapes on the ride. She needn't worry about missing the bus; it won't leave for almost another half hour as passengers continue to arrive.
The two drivers help load cargo into the side hold as more people come. When the bus fills up, they climb on and close the door.
They walk to the back of the bus and start asking for tickets. Nobody seems to have bought them ahead of time, and there's good reason why: It's more expensive if you buy them online. So the passengers hand over their $20 and the bus driver punches a hole in an index card-sized manila ticket and hands it back.
When all the passengers are checked, one driver pops a tape into the VCR as the other starts the bus. A Taiwanese variety show comes up on the screens and the lights go out. The bus rolls out of the parking lot and onto Kellam. It's 12:52 in the morning.
The show is obviously popular with the crowd, because even without sound, the skits keep most of them awake and laughing. It features a fashionable group of 20-somethings, two boys and three girls, who could be a pop group of some kind. The tall, handsome one singles out a teen in the audience and leads her by the hand to the piano as the other begins singing to her. She is crying and shaking, a fan who looks as if she can't believe her luck.
As the bus makes its way toward the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel, there is still some chatter, but it is dying down. Jacky Jiang, who works in the kitchen of a Chinese restaurant in Suffolk, reclines and continues watching the show, settling in for his trip. He is headed to New York to pick up his parents, who will return on Old Tiger to visit him in Suffolk.
By the time the bus is over the dark water, there is nary a peep, save the occasional ringing cell phone. The driver's ring tone is set on Auld Lang Syne, and by the end of the trip, it feels like New Year's Eve.
The advertisement says six hours, and the driver is determined to prove it.
The Eastern Shore is quiet country by day and desolate by night. Most of the lights are green, and the driver keeps the speedometer at 70 mph, even after one turns red. Luckily, the white pickup to the right sees the bus coming and heeds its horn, waiting while Old Tiger roars through the intersection.
At 2:10, the bus pulls off U.S. 13 and rolls into an Exxon station in Onley. Most riders snooze through this stop except the smokers, who get up right away for their fix.
It takes 18 minutes and $70.11 of diesel fuel and the bus is ready to go again. The station attendant waves the bus on and tells them to come back soon. By now, the variety show is over.
At 2:52 a.m., the bus pulls off Route 13 and into the parking lot of a bank. It's not clear why the bus is stopping until the driver opens the door and lets on a young Asian man. They nod to each other, and the new passenger takes a seat. At 3:25, the bus pulls off again without any notice into a Wal-Mart parking lot. But the person who is supposed to be here isn't. The bus barely stops before it roars out of the parking lot and back on to the open road. It must have been the wrong store: 20 minutes later, the same thing happens: The bus pulls off at another Wal-Mart, where a young woman is waiting with a suitcase. Twenty minutes later, another stop, this time at a Food Lion. A young couple with bags and a gallon of milk hops on.
It's now 4:18 a.m., and a baby is crying as the bus pulls back onto Route 13 and continues north up the Eastern Shore, headed for Delaware.
Delaware comes and goes quickly compared to the Eastern Shore: From the state's welcome sign to New Jersey takes 38 minutes. The bus roars onto the Jersey Turnpike at 5:21. Dawn breaks as the bus crosses the Verrazano Narrows Bridge toward New York City.
Jiang, the kitchen worker, has been asleep for hours, his head bobbing with the motion of the bus. Now, his head falls between the seats. He wakes up and looks around to see where he is. He readjusts the bright yellow jacket he's using as a blanket and closes his eyes for more sleep.
At 20 minutes to 6, daylight streams into the bus. Passengers are slumped low in their reclined seats. Those who got two to themselves dangle their feet over the armrest and into the aisle. Others slouch against the window or the person next to them. It's been five hours, and the velvet seats start to feel like they're closing in.
At 6:32, Jiang rises and looks ahead. He is awake and ready to be there. Ten minutes later, the little girl up front is awake and playing peek-a-boo again. Her bow is now off to the left side after a fitful sleep, but she is smiling.
The bus rounds a bend, and Newark is in sight. There is a skyline, the first of the tall buildings to the north, but it is not the skyline. Still, the end feels near.
At two minutes before 7, there it is: New York City.
Sim San Chan looks out the right side of the bus and sees the Statue of Liberty, standing there in all her glory. Chan combs her hair. She is almost there.
The bus dips into the Holland Tunnel and exits onto Hudson Street, in the heart of Tribeca, lower Manhattan's trendy neighborhood.
It's 7:14 as the bus makes its way up Broadway toward Chinatown. The air in the bus is stale. Only a few more minutes.
At 7:21, the bus enters Chinatown. It's Sunday, yet the merchants are out, hosing down the sidewalks and arranging the fruit stands. At 7:23, the bus stops at Canal and Eldridge streets, in front of Wong Wah Bakery House Inc. and the Canal Cup and Saucer. Ford and Chan have arrived, only 31 minutes past the six-hour travel mark but nearly an hour behind schedule.
Ford makes her way toward the front and climbs slowly down the stairs onto solid ground. She smiles wearily. Her skirt is creased and her hair is matted in the back from resting her head on the seat. What did she think?
"I'm gonna take it again," she says.
On cue, a friend calls to see if she arrived OK. "No complaints," she tells her.
The time and price were right for Ford. She couldn't sleep well, but she never does on the bus, she says.
"It's a lot quieter than the Greyhound. A lot of times the driver has to tell them to be quiet."
The only problem, she says, was not being able to get into the bathroom.
"There was a little bit of a language barrier. I tried to ask the guy in the back, but he couldn't understand me. That's a bit of a problem."
Suddenly, she remembers she still needs to use the bathroom. She climbs back on the bus and heads toward the rear. This time, she is not afraid of waking anyone up, and she uses her full might to get the door open.
Chan is off the bus and smiling, though she, too, appears a bit tired. She points up at a tall building and says that's where her mom lives.
"Maybe I'll sleep for a few hours and go into Chinatown then," she says.
The two are the last ones on the sidewalk when Ford realizes she has no idea where the closest subway stop is. She needs to get to Queens.
Chan obliges, and leads her up Canal. It is right where she said it would be.
The two first-timers wave good-bye, for now. They will see each other again Tuesday, when they are scheduled to board Old Tiger for Hampton Roads.
Reach Allison Connolly at 446-2318 or allison.connolly pilotonline.com
So I take it the bus goes via DelMarVa, makes sense. I think the Greyhound runs take the same routing. Never been down that way. I definately would like to see it(especially the bridge-tunnel).
I don't think I'll be riding these buses ever though, considering this guys blasting through red lights are 70 when there are other cars about to cross the street.
Still, something in the article said there was a white van or something that started going cuz he had the green, then saw the bus and stopped to prevent from being hit by it.
Public Sector News:Mass Transit
ROAD WARRIOR: Riding Out Hot Summer
Las Vegas Review - Journal
Jun 08, 12:42 PM
The mercury topped 100 degrees downtown as Robert Warrengton waited under a canopy for a bus Wednesday afternoon. He wasn't sure his ride would be any cooler.
"Sometimes, it makes you feel like you're in an oven. Most of the time, they don't even have the air-conditioning on," the 50-year- old Las Vegan said about the inside of the bus. "It's better out here."
But there's not much the daily bus rider can do. He still needs to get where he needs to go. "Grin and bear it," he said of how he copes. "You just have to bear it."
There's not much Citizens Area Transit officials say they can do, either. At best, bus temperatures will be only 15 degrees cooler than the air outside, even with the AC cranking.
So, on a day that hits, oh, 114 degrees -- and we had a couple of days like that last year -- the inside of a bus can be a more-than- toasty 99 degrees for CAT's daily haul of 150,000 riders.
"We operate in a desert climate," said Barrick Neill, transportation director for ATC, the company that operates CAT for the Regional Transportation Commission. "We have not had success with the manufacturer that makes our vehicles for them to produce an air-conditioning unit for the desert climate."
Routes that make frequent stops are problematic, such as Route 109 along Maryland Parkway.
"A lot of passengers ride that route. The doors are constantly opening, loading passengers and unloading passengers," Neill said. "The more you stop and the more frequently the doors open, the more hot air will get in."
Some passengers say not only can a hot bus be uncomfortable, it can be smelly, too.
"Everybody's worked all day, you know? Deodorant only lasts so long," said bus rider Heidi Rose, 47, of Las Vegas.
But her greatest sympathy goes to the drivers.
"Could you imagine to be on a bus all day with no air? I'm amazed none of them have fainted," she said. "For us, it's only a half-an- hour. For them, it's an eight-hour shift."
Rose said when the air-conditioning on a bus is working, it often isn't working very well. She said drivers facing an overheated engine sometimes give riders a choice: "Do you want to go somewhere or do you want air?"
Neill said drivers shouldn't do that. All CAT buses should have air-conditioning units working at all times.
"If the bus driver has determined the air-conditioning is not working, he or she should be calling for a replacement bus immediately," he said.
In that vein, CAT divided the valley into quadrants and keeps so- called "ready coaches" in each one, ready to replace a balky bus on short notice, usually within 20 minutes.
"If there's a vehicle that goes down because of the air- conditioning or if the air-conditioning isn't working, we'll dispatch a vehicle on that route," Neill said.
Also, supervisors will be sent to the location of the broken bus to pass out water as needed to hot passengers.
Drivers don't carry water for the public, and passengers normally aren't allowed to bring open containers on board. But if you carry a capped bottle of agua aboard at this time of year, it's unlikely you'll be hassled.
"We usually relax that policy a little bit in the summertime," Neill said.
And drivers are asked to use a "fast idle" engine setting when possible. That setting provides a boost of cool air from AC units while a bus is stopped for a long period of time.
Drivers also are trained to recognize heat stroke in passengers and call for help, Neill said.
The Clark County School District doesn't share similar concerns in operating about 350 buses a day for schools in summer sessions.
"It hasn't been a problem," said Ronald Despenza, the district's transportation director.
He said the district's larger buses have specially designed air conditioners that have extra-large compressors. "It does provide excess cooling capacity," Despenza said.
And unlike CAT buses that stop every block or so, most school buses make infrequent stops, allowing cool air to build up inside.
Students usually aren't allowed to bring drinks on board, but "if it's a very hot day, we will allow students to board the buses with water bottles," Despenza said.
Despenza advises parents to slather their kids in sunscreen before having then wait for buses in the hot sun.
Likewise, Neill advised CAT riders to make sure they are getting plenty of water before getting on a bus, especially if they're waiting at an uncovered bus stop.
Katie Rogers, who rides CAT every day, isn't fazed by hot buses. "I can't complain. The buses I usually ride are nice. Except where the sun creeps in," she said.
That's because, in her mind, a hot summer day in the valley is better than a freezing winter day in her native Chicago.
"It beats it hands down, as far as I'm concerned," she said.
ROAD WORK AHEAD
Westbound East Charleston Boulevard between Honolulu Street (west of U.S. Highway 95) and Nellis Boulevard will have lane restrictions through early August. Delays should be expected. Some side streets at Charleston may be temporarily closed at times. Access to U.S. 95 ramps and local businesses will be maintained. Eastbound traffic should not be affected.
Northbound U.S. Highway 95 from Horizon Drive and Lake Mead Drive will have lane reductions through this fall.
If you have a question, tip or tirade, call the Road Warrior at 387-2904, or e-mail him at roadwarrior@reviewjournal.com or
OSofradzija@reviewjournal.com. Please
include your phone number.
Moat of their buses have the rooftop Sutrak air conditioners, which do a pretty damn good job considering the heat they have to put up with. CAT usually keeps the buses pretty clean, too. Again, it's just the ungodly awful traffic they have to sit in while negotiating their routes.
So I take it the bus goes via DelMarVa, makes sense. I think the Greyhound runs take the same routing. Never been down that way. I definately would like to see it(especially the bridge-tunnel).
I don't think I'll be riding these buses ever though, considering this guys blasting through red lights are 70 when there are other cars about to cross the street.
Still, something in the article said there was a white van or something that started going cuz he had the green, then saw the bus and stopped to prevent from being hit by it.
I got to drive one of those before I left.
Trevor
Trevor, thanks for the info. I take it this is temporary use of these buses until the buses that Rockland County ordered come in later this year. I also assume these replace the 1100 coaches that had been in service recently. Perhaps they also replace some or all of the Orion I's.
Video here
David
BIG AL
Da Hui
That's my story and I'm sticking to it!
Just a Though
Da Hui
C.W.
SAS
Moat of their buses have the rooftop Sutrak air conditioners, which do a pretty damn good job considering the heat they have to put up with. CAT usually keeps the buses pretty clean, too. Again, it's just the ungodly awful traffic they have to sit in while negotiating their routes.
MTA had problems with the RTSs as WMATA had problems with the Neoplans, both were retired early, but none were saved for any antique or rodeo fleet.
Academy's 1000 series Novas are from the same order as all other 1001-1580 or so NJT Novas. The only exception are some of the Academy 1000 series Novas used in Rutgers service, which were ordered by Academy when it obtained the Rutgers contract.
The federal government really pushed systems to buy the RTS and 870 'Advanced Design Buses', but many refused. Part of it was the bad reputation both the 870 and RTS were getting, but an equally big part was cost. In 1979, Boston's MBTA budgeted funds to buy 100 new buses. When the bids were opened, GM-Canada's winning bid was so much less than expected that the MBTA used the left-over money to buy 27 additional 35-foot buses. The grass-roots refusal of many operators to blindly buy ADB buses helped many of today's bus manufacturers get up and running. Flyer, Orion, Neoplan and Gillig all benefited from the desire of many cities to avoid the problem-plagued ADB's.
Jim D.
I don't know if any other city did what WMATA did, but WMATA rebuilt the RTSs to have slide open windows, also sealed one of the three airvents they had along with removing the manual signs for the electronic flip dot sign. To solve the door problem they just replaced those doors with the standard rear doors.
As far as Novas[RTS and Classics], and Neoplans, I do not know. But it could be economically feasible if someone tried.
You must join the group to acess the pictures. It's an open group so all you have to do is join, no waiting for approval.
The url is http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BUS-O-RAMA
I sure that the engineers would find a way to attach the wings to any bus. Question, as always, is how much would it cost and how much revenue would they generate ?
(zzzz...)
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.info
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
No buses were "sent;" DOT was the taker.
I have also uploaded some shots of British buses that are now in North America, including Dennis Tridents in New York and Victoria and older double deckers in Philadelphia and British Colombia.
Chuck Greene
It's only routes which run within reasonable distance of a high school or middle school.
David
What's the distinction between a tripper and a short trip?
A short trip is any regularly scheduled 'line bus' (any run that doesn't contain a school tripper) which maintains the regular route, although will terminate somewhere short of the regular terminal designed to carry a bulk of passengers along a major portion of a route. Short trips run regardless of when school is in session, unless that particular short trip is designated as a 'school tripper'.
David
Try checking the back of each borough's bus map (visible on the MTA website) for the timing and starting points of school trips that start "off-line," or away from the regular route. For example, the M96 includes the following note: "On school days, additional service runs from 1 Av/East 99 St to West 97 St/West End Av at 2:33 and 2:38PM."
To obtain that information, call the NYCT DOB Customer Relations Center at (888) 692-8287.
sorry....
Chuck Greene
:-)
By-the-way, "CDTA", don't bother responding to this post. You'll only be wasting whatever functioning and somewhat-matured brain cells you may have, because I refuse to engage a self-proclaimed 11-year old whose command of the english language, grammar skills and punctuation use is the equivalent to that of a four year old semi-conscious crack-addict.
David
The 99S runs from Bayonne to the PA Terminal. Coach USA/Red and Tan Lines, Hudson County division runs it. They also took over the Lafayette and Greenville routes (3, 4, 5, 11, 16), the Central Avenue route (now #231) as well as the #10 South Hudson Blvd and the nos. 122 and 144 Staten Island-Jersey City routes.
Check out their website; it's really nice! -- www.redandtan.com.
MetroB
MetroB
NJ Transportation Heritage Museum
You may also want to check out the Museum of Bus Transportation in Pennsylvania at http://www.busmuseum.org
Regards,
Jimmy
http://www.car-free.org/ambass.pdf
This is for the TA in Allentown, PA
Enjoy!
There's a ton of service from the Lehigh Valley to NYC via Trans Bridge (Allentown, Bethlehem, South Bethlehem, and Easton) or Bieber (Allentown).
Ideally, there could be a way in the distant future to connect the Lehigh Valley with SEPTA:
Extend the 96 from Telford to Quakertown; split the 96 into two routes at Lansdale station - the 96/Norristown to Lansdale via MCCC, North Wales and Montgomery Mall and a 200-series route (such as 203)/Lansdale to Quakertown via Hatfield, Souderton, Telford, and Perkasie/Sellersville.
LANTA could consider a route from Quakertown to either Allentown (via PA 309 and Coopersburg) or Bethlehem via 309 and PA 378 - there's a shopping center on the bottom of the hill in Lower Saucon, Northampton County (Bethlehem) on 378; there's also the main campus of DeSales University that's a couple miles further south in Upper Saucon, Lehigh County just off of 378.
Portions of 309 between Quakertown and Allentown have become just as sprawl inducing as most of the corridors closer to Philly (see Baltimore Pike in Springfield, Delaware County or old US 1 in Middletown, Bucks). In Quakertown/Richland Twp, at the intersection of 309 and 313/663 (313 takes you to Quakertown CBD and Doylestown; 663 takes you to Pottstown and the PA Turnpike), there are numerous traffic generators (Acme, WalMart, K-Mart, all the usual shopping center suspects) which could provide a decent transit ridership base, at least coming from the Allentown/Bethlehem areas (and, to a lesser extent, from Quakertown proper).
It would seem to be an ideal corridor for LANTA to consider assuming (a) Bucks County approaches them about it and/or (b) SEPTA signs off on it. Another downside is that there really aren't too many transit friendly locations along 309 between the Lehigh/Bucks county line and the 309/313/663 intersection, nor are there that many major transit-related generators in that corridor in Springfield Twp, Bucks County (yes, there is such a place) or the northern part of Richland (before you get to the Acme, WalMart, et al). Then again, the same could be said for portions of PA 611 between PA 132 and Doylestown Twp (before 611 splits off to bypass Doylestown proper), but the 55 connects Doylestown and Broad-Olney.
Anything is possible, but what I suggested is a long way from becoming a reality...
MetroB
I hope this answers your question :-)
What's great about the lack of middle seats is that it forces people to fill up the back row. I can't tell you how many times people would refuse to sit in those seats when the middle seat is available and taken. Of course, it is unfortunate when one has to squeeze next to a not so slim person...
I always hated that middle back seat. It was the only one where you really couldn't hold on if the bus stopped fast. You'd turn into a human bowling ball if the driver really jammed on the brakes.
Orion VII - the low floor monster
Montgomery County's Ride On
What excatly is that component/device?
A Detroit Diesel Series 50 Diesel engine
How come the older orions (LIBs 100-287) don't have that?
They do not have a Detroit Diesel Series 50 Diesel Engine.
it was so wierd riding a repower and seeing a full row of seats in the back. hey, how did they manage to put a DD50 in those?
Dought it. Triboro only has a test filling station (one lane & slow) and no place to park the buses (the CNGs have to go in the street because the garage was never made explosion proof).
CNG buses are no longer on parked on the street due to a call from the FBI! :O
Thanks.
When speaking to a former factory technician today, I found out that QS has one John Deere CNG engine. I was shocked to hear this! And from what he said, the engine performs AWESOME!!
Plus the detroit's aren't problem free. But that's what happens when you try to make a silk purse out of a cows ear (convert a diesel into a CNG)
Two JD's? Do you know the numbers off hand??
On a GM new look, it would do the same, but one of the window panels was blanked.
You have to register on the site to read the article, but if anyone has the article from The Record, please post it.
But hey, that's what you get when you are serious about implementation of "free market" competition with mass transportation on the roads. I have seen what "free market" has to offer, and I prefer the "socialized" version, TYVM.
Actually calling those things "Jitneys" is an insult to the REAL jitneys in Atlantic City.
If I was the Port Authority, I would use my powers to hassle them out of existence, like stopping them and do a "spot" inspection, if the vehicle fails inspection, take them out of service, and strand the stupid passengers on them.
Associated Press
Monday, June 14, 2004; 6:43 AM
A six-year-old boy from Arlington died Sunday after darting into the path of a Fairfax Connector bus.
It happened just before 8:00 p.m. when Fairfax County police spokesperson Mary Ann Jennings said the boy and his family were visiting other family in the area and had parked their car on the street.
As they were unloading, the boy ran into the road from between two cars and into the path of the bus. He was pronounced dead at the scene.
The child's name was not immediately released.
About half a dozen passengers were on the bus, but none were hurt in the accident.
There was no immediate word on whether charges would be filed and Jennings said police investigators planned to inspect the bus, looking for any mechanical problems that may have contributed to the accident.
"The buses are coming through this neighborhood way too fast"
"They should slow the buses down"
"I never knew buses can go this fast"
"It's all the bus's fault"
blah blah blah, and so on and so forth.
All the meanwhile it was the CHILD's fault for running out in front of the bus. Now the residents want to reroute that particular bus line to completely avoid their neighborhood.
Da Hui
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
Now as for the people who want the line rerouted because of this, what if that was a speeding car that hit him, they would they ban the cars, no, to solve the overall speeding problem, just put in speed humps, banning a bus line isn't going to solve the problem, what if the bus line is banned and then another child is hit by a car. Before one is quick to take action on something they need to cool down and think.
The real proof will be the bus's brakes and how they were applied. If it was a short skid mark, then the bus wasn't speeding and it was just the child flew unexpectedly in front of the bus at the last minute. My hunch is that the child at the last minute ran in front of the bus and the bus hit him. If they were speeding then the appropriate action needs to be taken against the driver.
hey, if the child won't stay still, use a leash. Today in Alexandria I saw a lady pull along about 10 children, who each had a hand tighted to a line of some sort. It was amusing to watch - i would've taken a picture, but I didn't want to "invade privacy" or whatnot.
It really is unfortunate when this happens. Although it is easy to say "watch the children all the time" it isn't always possible. In my opinion, I don't think anyone was wholy at fault. Just some freak accident I guess...I sympathize with both the parents, the driver, and the Fairfax Connector company. I hope this doesn't bring down the image of the Fairfax - it's a good company - i rode it today, and liked it.
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
I just hate it driving through residential areas where kids are running all over the place not paying attention to where they are going. Then, their ball comes out into the road, etc.
When my 8 year old niece and 5 year old nephew came, we didn't let go of their hands no matter if we were the only car around. They knew better too, so that helps.
Look left and right - believe me, you teach it to the kids, make it a game of some sort, they'll remember.
Of course, it's just so easy to blame the transit authority - I hope that driver is getting counseling and not just getting bombarded by all of this chaos alone.
(06/14/04) THROGS NECK - City Council members and union officials are sounding an alarm Monday over the fact that the MTA's takeover of Liberty Bus Line and New York Bus service may not happen as scheduled.
The city is supposed to take over the bus service to Manhattan through the Bronx by July 1 but union officials say there are some items that need to be addressed first. The union wants to know how much the pension will be for the bus workers and what their status will be when they become city employees.
If the takeover goes past the deadline, there could be disruptions in service. A spokesperson for Mayor Bloomberg says the mayor believes the talks are going as planned and he's confident that the deadline will be reached.
The mayor has the authority to extend the deadline if necessary.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
MetroB
The REALLY shitty Metro B's are out of Washington Twp. They are used mostly on the 400/403/406 lines although since these buses are falling apart on a daily basis, these lines have MCI's mixed in on certain runs.[These lines really shouldn't have MCI's on them because they have extensive running in Camden, and these lines need to be converted to exact fare, mostly because the drivers tend to get robbed a lot]. Washington Twp has about 6 baby RTS's but they're only good on the 459 and 463 lines.
Egg Harbor City's RTS's and the two Metro D's are used on the Atlantic City local lines.
So there are not enough newer transit/suburban equipment to cover the runs made by the Metro B's.
Thanks.
-Adam
(fishbowl6v92ta@aol.com)
Heh, I wonder if the character (Nova RTS 1999) is CDTA's long lost cousin...LOL. ;-)
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
David
-Ben Diamond (a.k.a. 4traintowoodlawn)
Also, easier said than done.
More info on that when i am more awake.
The bus driver has become an occupation that nobody wants. They think a bus driver is uneducated, and just couldn't do better. They are barely more than a number nowadays too, with the badge numbers and whatnot. "we need more drivers so we can operate more service on this route". Transit has become impersonal, and that's one of the reasons I'm not the biggest supporter of big transit such as WMATA, SEPTA, NYCTA. It seems like as long as the number are sufficient, it doesn't matter what runs where.
Apparently, people need incentive to do things well. Paying more is always good, but it tends to make people fake. How about periodically having a social or even something simple like a thank you card or joke comic in the driver's area before he drives off? Maybe that would cheer him up before he has to face the stress of ignorant people. Maybe he would be friendlier too.
I also agree with you about the passengers themselves - they can be pigs, rude, and whatnot. A bus driver stops for you away from the stop, or waits for you - why can't you say thank you? Of course, if he didnt' do that, all hell would be let loose, but he doesnt' have to anyway. In fact, he probably isn't permitted to. Just a simple hello, a smile, and brighten someone's day. I know that it does for me when I'm working a 8hr plus shift, tired, and hungry, and a cheerful person comes up to me.
About the company and the buses it sends out, a bus with working a/c must be a priority on hot days. however, if there is nothing else available, and I mean absolutely nothing (like the other buses won't move or they are in horrid condition), I'd rather have a bus without a/c come up to endure for a little while than not have it show up. Maybe warning the passengers that the bus is a/c-les will help too.
I agree with you on all of the points you made - some are more feasible than others, though, and once in a while, sacrifices must be made. Hopefully if I ever start my company, I'd make transit a little bit friendlier. It's sad when people are scared to take the bus, because they could get lost or get mugged.
Transit image needs to raise up, and not just with rail.
I don't know if it's required, but some NYC B/Os use the PA to announce the next stop and connecting bus service.
Passengers have to learn to move to the back of the bus so others can get on.
Michael
Washington, DC
This is usually done in Manhattan on Limited Buses like the M15. But I've heard it on some local buses too at major intersections.
Regards,
Jimmy
BIG AL
Gotta love that "GEO MASON UNIV" designation.
Q2 SHADY GRVE
J2 SLVR SPRG
And things like that. I spent a good deal of time at Silver Spring today but can not recall the other abbreviations I didn't really like. I find that the brighter sign doesn't provide much more information than the hard to read one if there are so many abbreviations like that. Yes, I know what they refer to but riders not familiar with the bus system may be baffled initially.
Not sure when this happened, but 2219 now shows a route on its side sign. It didn't used to.
BEFORE:
FRIENDSHIP HTS
NOW:
32 FRIENDSHIP
32 HEIGHTS
However, Fresh Pond does have more 4000's than I've seen in awhile. A total of 49, which is up I believe 2 from the middle of last month when I was last over there. Additions to their fleet besides the 9100's are: 4858, 4860, 4861, 4865 and 4869. (forgive me if you guys already know that)
Some good news on scraps: buses 4410 (I didn't even know they had that), 4707, 4737 and 4739 have been scrapped, leaving 45 4000's in service.
8112 and 8135 are out with cracked bulkheads and 5062 is still out with a cracked chassis.
BIG AL
I couldn't agree more. :)
They will once again be the most dominating series in FP.
#9061-#9110. Ulmer Park.
#9111-#9185. Fresh Pond.
And keep #9228-#9249 at Ulmer Park.
B1-#9109-NOVABUS
B64-#9102-NOVABUS.
Besides, didn't Ulmer Park have #9031 and #9040 once?
Robert
I thought MCH was getting 6365-6429. Has that been changed?
BIG AL
BIG AL
Besides, I only found out about the event from watching TransitTransit News.
3758
5227
7340
8928
236
I didn't get there until 4, and at least one bus had already departed (I passed it at Kings Plaza). By that time nobody was checking ID at the gate, although the hat distributor turned me down.
When are you at Stillwell this weekend, or do we need to figure that out?
BIG AL
By ALEX GINSBERG
---------------------------------------------------------------------
June 15, 2004 -- Non-union workers for four of the city's private bus services are trying to block the MTA's July 1 takeover of the companies in court.
In a lawsuit filed in Queens Supreme Court late last week, the 127 employees allege the city and MTA would violate a federal agreement by not guaranteeing them job security, pay stability and continuation of benefits.
"The entire workforce has to be protected and given employment," said Jerome Cooper, CEO for four of the private bus lines — Jamaica Bus, Green Bus, Command Bus and Triboro Coach.
"Wages and pensions and health benefits must be protected by the City of New York and the MTA."
According to the complaint, a 1975 agreement with the Federal Transit Administration binds the city to provide "protective arrangements" for all employees.
But Cooper — who is a plaintiff in the suit — said he had not received any definitive word about the fate of the 127 and other non-union workers from either the city or the MTA.
Cooper said at some point the city and the MTA told him that the jobs would "probably" be secure, but he had no guarantee.
MTA spokesman Tom Kelly referred all questions to the city.
Kate Ahlers, a spokeswoman for the city law department, said city attorneys were reviewing the suit but weren't prepared to comment on it.
There are 400,000 riders a day on the four private bus lines represented in the suit.
The same four companies filed a federal lawsuit last September alleging that the city was deliberately underfunding the bus lines.
Cooper said that suit had been dismissed but the decision was being appealed.
David
"Grummans died a premature death in NYC, there are numerous factors involved " You're absolutely correct - and NYCTA's crappy maintenance was one of those factors. I'm glad we agree on something.
Also you DON'T know me, yet you seem to know how I think. If you insist on taking this down a negative path... Why do it publicly??? Instead of engaging in this sarcasm crap. How about you be mature about this and take it to e-mail. My e-mail addy link always right there.
-Fred
Take care.
-Fred
Sigh, how sickening - the transit world is going new flyer...it's too bad NABI and Neoplan screwed up with Baltimore...
Any word on when these Gillig Advantages are coming in?
Also, 1982 was the last full year of production for the Grumman 870 before it became the Flxible Metro. Another car example: the Dodge Aspen and Plymouth Volare. They were new and different...so much, in fact, that when they came out in 1976, they were Motor Trend's Car Of The Year. However, quality control problems plagued the first two model years; premature rust, hoods flew open, and brakes failed. Most people with 1979 and 1980 models had little or no complaints.
-Fred
As far as NYC, some of the NYCDOT companies, namely the Jamaica Buses, Inc. kept their 1979 Grummans in service up until 2000 or 2001-21 or 22 years and trust me, there are truly raggedy streets in southeast Queens, the area served by Jamaica Buses, Inc.
The rest of the NYCDOT's (except Triboro) kept their Grummans well into the early and mid 1990s with Queens Surface retiring theirs around 1998 with the arrival of the Orion V CNGs.
So, I don't know what to tell you about the MTA.